12/31/20 at 10:49PM UTC
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If I work off the books training people in the gym (for my self not employed by the gym) but had to stop due to Covid do I still have to look for work if I get unemployment?
I was getting paid in cash. I plan to build back clients after Covid and do the same work. Can I get unemployment until I go back to training ppl. I prefer doing what I do not other jobs.
DarlaM
I have worn many hats in different industries.
359
01/04/21 at 12:41PM UTC
Something else you may want to look into is the PPP loans for small businesses. The SBA and your bank should have more information for you.
Ann Wisdom
50
01/04/21 at 1:08PM UTC
Thank you. I will look into that. My hope is to return to my nursing position but in the meantime, this could possibly lead to a new endeavor for me.
DarlaMI have worn many hats in different industries.
359
01/04/21 at 10:59AM UTC
I'm sorry. But yes, the original poster was being bullied. Instead of jumping to conclusions, I asked her what she meant. But a bunch of you were just plan mean spirited and condescending and hiding behind your "anonymous" posts so people do not see the real you. Shame on you all that behaved this way. I love hateful people hiding their disgraceful behaviours from the World! Not!!
Ann Wisdom, there are some awesome women in this group. Try to focus on what they said and ignore the trolls.
2020 brought in a lot of trolls that have zero idea of how to be supportive to one another. And they all do the same, hide behind anonymous posts and make rude and harsh comments, trying to tear others down. I have found the best way to handle people like that is to just ignore them.
Best of luck to you.
Ann Wisdom
50
01/04/21 at 11:52AM UTC
Thank you Ms. Darla few of you made my day for speaking up and really encouraged me. Its crazy the amount of hate and intolerance a simple question evoked. Ironically 2020 was the year of the nurse; which I am by profession. However it was also a year of ugliness, hatred, and inhumanity. As humans, women, and a country, I still believe we are better than this. I am so very sorry I even came across this forum. I will now ignore them( since I have made my replies). Bullying has many faces and they are all ugly and unacceptable. I literally read the comments and cried initially not understanding why. Being helpful rather than hateful is always the right choice. Chose love people. I God Bless you and protect you and your family. Thank you once again.
DarlaMI have worn many hats in different industries.
359
01/04/21 at 12:33PM UTC
Thank you Ann. And you are most welcome. Some people are so miserable in their own lives, they feel entitled to attempt to bring others down so they feel superior. 2020 should have taught people to love more and hate less. But between the politics and all of the self entitlement that is being taught, I feel it will continue to get worse. A customer of mine summed it up perfectly. She said some people have forgotten how to be human. My opinion they were probably never told no as children and now feel they can do and say anything they want with out retribution. They know they are wrong in their behavior so they hide like the cowards they are behind anonymous masks so the world doesn't see them for the despicable human beings that they truly are.
Marci Diaz AppleMedia and Communications Enthusiast
131
01/03/21 at 6:07PM UTC
Call outs are a way to put someone on the spot or embarrass them. I have found that a person seeking advice responds better to kind and informative conversation than being put in their place. I wonder if she will ever post in this group again?
I don’t want to group everyone together here, there were plenty of kind and helpful comments as well. I hope she will focus on those, they were just as informative.
Ann Wisdom
50
01/04/21 at 10:16AM UTC
Thank you Marci, and I did feel extremely bullied and embarrassed for even asking. You don’t have to say it but I will; some of their responses were very “Karen-like.” You appear to be a well balanced and upstanding person. The world can use more of you. God bless you. Be safe.
User edited comment on 01/04/21 at 11:53AM UTC
Marci Diaz AppleMedia and Communications Enthusiast
131
01/02/21 at 10:39PM UTC
I apologize for the “Karen” comment, I can see now that it could be offensive. I absolutely stand by my feelings about the way she was called out. It was mean, and based on too little information. Or perhaps she could use a mentor, or someone to help with perspective. I am immediately triggered when I feel someone is being bullied. There were many other tactful and informative ways that other women in this group replied, and I should have focused on that.
User deleted comment on 01/04/21 at 10:11AM UTC
Anonymous
01/03/21 at 12:46AM UTC
She’s not being bullied, she’s getting called out for unethical behavior...and frankly, illegal behavior!
Ann Wisdom
50
01/04/21 at 10:15AM UTC
Who made you the moral police and since when was working for cash unethical and illegal? On the contrary, it is your response that is unethical and inappropriate. If its illegal why are there cash only businesses all around? Also why are there tax forms for people who work for cash and why is this category of work acknowledged on the dept. of labor’s website? Please be informed before you speak. You apparently have no conscience or insight if you cannot recognize bullying and inappropriate behavior. People like you and your ideologies and intolerances for others should always be called out. Shame on you and your mean girls club. Grow up and expand your thinking. Tomes have changed.
Thank you....next!
User edited comment on 01/04/21 at 12:49PM UTC
BN
211
01/02/21 at 6:47PM UTC
Working off the books for cash means you are not declaring taxes. As an FYI, it is illegal not to declare taxes and you would be subject to criminal charges,fines and interest on any unpaid taxes. It also means you are not paying into your state's unemployment.
If you are saying you are self-unemployed, you should look at your state's guide for self employed individuals to walk you through the process. You will need to pay unemployment insurance and I'm sure your taxes. In the meantime yes in order to collect unemployment you are supposed to be looking for a job unless you report to a union.
Ann Wisdom
50
01/05/21 at 6:08PM UTC
Kindly stop contacting me. It’s a whole new day and you’re still beating the same horse, it’s already. Unlike you, I have better things to do with my time. You’ve spoken your piece and had your time. I don’t need any more of your crazy, disrespectful BS, leave me alone.
Thank you
Ann Wisdom
50
01/04/21 at 11:43AM UTC
Where did you get this incomplete definition from? If I said I have a “gig” training people would that be acceptable to you, b/c many “gigs” are off the books...similar thing but coming from different places. I pay taxes in large amounts since me and my husband are RNs. Self employed, gig, work for cash, off the books... pick one. Cab drivers, dog walkers, personal trainers, can all be self employed( drug dealers, and prostitutes, are self employed as well. How do you determine from this group who really pays taxes?
Thank you...next!!!
User edited comment on 01/04/21 at 12:49PM UTC
BN
211
01/05/21 at 3:07PM UTC
@Ann -Thank you next? You need to check yourself or maybe try a dictionary- perhaps you aren't aware but "working off the books" is the definition of working & not declaring income. It comes from not recording someone on accounting books to avoid taxes. It has nothing got do with the gig economy.
So yeah - I'm looking at someone who said they work off the books, which means they aren't paying taxes, so it's not a leap.
Marci Diaz AppleMedia and Communications Enthusiast
131
01/02/21 at 4:12PM UTC
I didn’t read anywhere in her post that she doesn’t pay taxes on her income. I see some of you have jumped to conclusions and decided to scold her. So what’s missing here? The benefit of the doubt. This isn’t a job interview, it’s a place to ask for advice and not be torn down or shamed. Calm down, Karen. You probably don’t have the whole story.
User edited comment on 01/02/21 at 4:13PM UTC
User deleted comment on 01/04/21 at 10:47AM UTC
User deleted comment on 01/04/21 at 10:06AM UTC
Ann Wisdom
50
01/04/21 at 8:33AM UTC
Thank you so much for your reply Marci. You are very kind and open minded. I am new to this forum and was merely seeking advise. You are very correct, I will never come back to this site again. I was not expecting such harsh and mean spirited rebukes I actually do pay taxes on the money I make. My husband and I file jointly and include every penny that I make in cash. God Bless you for your kindness and for giving me the benefit of the doubt. Thank you.
User edited comment on 01/04/21 at 11:25AM UTC
Anonymous
01/02/21 at 6:37PM UTC
I don't think others are jumping to conclusions. There are just standard ways of doing business, and she appears to be breaking those norms without grasping that. There is nothing inherently wrong in being paid in cash, if the income is reported to the IRS and on state income tax forms. But, when someone uses the term "off the books", it implies that they are not doing that. Also, unless she has an arrangement with the gym to work there on a freelance basis, and pays them a fee, she is getting her workspace for nothing. After all, most gyms employ personal trainers to work with their clients, but they don't just give away the workspace or time. I know people who work as independent massage therapists, for example, and rent a space/time at a salon or spa to work. And then there are people who meet clients at places like Starbucks, but even then they are buying drinks and snacks to support that place of business. So, it seems like quite a stretch to want to use the norms of the system, like getting unemployment, only when it is convenient. Working off the books comes with its risks, and not getting unemployment benefits is one of them.
And, finally, your "Karen" reference is insulting. Don't use names or age cohorts to characterize others.
User deleted comment on 01/04/21 at 8:46AM UTC
Heather Cutler
411
01/02/21 at 7:50PM UTC
Your comment is spot on!
Anonymous
01/02/21 at 5:06PM UTC
“If I work off the books...” seems pretty obvious to me.
Ann Wisdom
50
01/04/21 at 9:56AM UTC
Hello!!! I am the one who asked that question. Try not to think too hard; your ignorance is showing. Many people work off the books, is that a bad thing in your world? It’s obviously legal and recognized by the IRS and unemployment. There are tax forms for such situations. Educate yourself before you speak. Thank you!!!
Anonymous
01/04/21 at 4:34PM UTC
Ann Wisdom - I don’t think that you understand how “off the books” is defined. Perhaps you should educate yourself before criticizing others. If you look up the definition it means not recorded or reported. Working for yourself in a cash driven business does not mean the work is “off the books”; not recording or reporting your revenue does.
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Anonymous
01/02/21 at 7:52PM UTC
I’m with you, also agree that “off the books” means paying no taxes.
Ann Wisdom
50
01/04/21 at 10:36AM UTC
Where are you people educating yourselves? I’m off the books since taxes are not taken directly out of what I am paid HOWEVER, that doesn’t translate to taxes aren’t paid on the back end. If this is the case, why are cash only businesses permitted to operate?
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Joanna Poe
637
01/02/21 at 2:37PM UTC
You're probably eligible for some assistance, but you can only collect unemployment if you or an employer paid into it.
Ann Wisdom
50
01/04/21 at 9:40AM UTC
Thank you. That is the usual requirement but they have adjusted it due to the pandemic and we pay taxes on everything.
Anonymous
01/02/21 at 1:46PM UTC
So I’m clear on your question: you bilk a system by working in cash, you avoid paying taxes on income earned, the rest of us cover your contribution to unemployment, and now you want to know how to tap a safety net that you’ve never contributed to? Come on FGB community, we’re better than this and should expect more out of each other! Best of luck to the poster in reaching out to your state’s Unemployment Commission. As someone else said, you need to prove income and your payment of state and federal taxes to take advantage of unemployment benefits.
User deleted comment on 01/04/21 at 9:36AM UTC
Anonymous
01/02/21 at 7:45PM UTC
Not taking any sides here but the poster didn’t say whether or not they paid taxes. They could have been paid in cash but still paid taxes (though I do think this is doubtful.) Just wanted to throw that out there.
Ann Wisdom
50
01/04/21 at 10:02AM UTC
Thank you for being insightful and logical. I was trying to be brief, not realizing ppl would read so negatively into a simple question. I we do pay taxes. Thanks for not judging.
Anonymous
01/02/21 at 2:33PM UTC
This, 100%
User edited comment on 01/02/21 at 2:34PM UTC
Ann Wisdom
50
01/06/21 at 12:28AM UTC
Ms. Anonymous, I think you should leave me alone at this point. I also think you clearly have nothing better to do with yourself and you need a life. Kindly stop commenting on this subject since its all coming to my email. You are now harassing me and need to stop. You people are totally crazy. Today is a new day and you actually took the time to respond again. Thank you for your definition of off the books. Now go and look up the definition of “leave me the hell alone”. You guys are not the only ones who can be nasty and ugly and rude. I’ve already acknowledged misuse of the phrase... get over it.
Anonymous
01/15/21 at 8:29PM UTC
maybe just turn off email notifications. and look up the definition of "harassment." cause it's definitely not responding to a question you posted, asking for advice.
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Ann Wisdom
50
01/04/21 at 10:23AM UTC
Really??? 100% wrong!!!
Anonymous
01/06/21 at 12:07AM UTC
I think you don’t know the meaning of “off the books.”. The phrase is used to as follows: Unreported employment, also known as money under the table, working under the table, off the books, cash-in-hand, or illicit work is illegal employment that is not reported to the government. The employer or the employee often does so for tax evasion or avoiding and violating other laws such as obtaining unemployment benefits while being employed. The working contract is made without social security costs, and does typically not provide health insurance, paid parental leave, paid vacation or pension funds. It is a part of what has been called the underground economy, shadow economy, black market or the non-observed economy.
User edited comment on 01/06/21 at 12:08AM UTC
Anonymous
01/02/21 at 1:38PM UTC
I doubt it, as you weren’t paying taxes and have no proof that you had this job. I’m pretty sure unemployment benefits are paid for by our taxes, so I don’t think you qualify.
Ann Wisdom
50
01/04/21 at 9:32AM UTC
I’m sorry, do you know me and my story??? Did I indicate that I did not pay taxes? How do you conclude that I had no proof that I had this job. You are correct to remain anonymous.
User edited comment on 01/04/21 at 10:22AM UTC
Anonymous
01/04/21 at 4PM UTC
It says you're getting paid off the book, which implies that you've not paying taxes. Take a deep breath. I wasn't accusing you of anything; that's the language *you* choose to use.
Ann Wisdom
50
01/04/21 at 5:28PM UTC
Yes, fair enough, that was the language I chose to explain the fact that I was paid in cash, no mention of not paying taxes. I had no idea “off the books” was a trigger phrase for so many ppl. In like manner “you” chose to assume I wasn’t paying taxes and had no proof of working. I can see where you apparently tried to respond based on assumptions.
Thank you for clarifying your position.
User deleted comment on 01/04/21 at 3:57PM UTC
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