I recommended an associate for a program that was competitive and would gain her a foot in an industry she was desperately trying to penetrate.

Anonymous

March 9,2023 at 6:50PM UTC

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I recommended an associate for a program that was competitive and would gain her a foot in an industry she was desperately trying to penetrate. She was accepted into the program. She left me a heartfelt voice message thanking me for the recommendation. She said it was life changing and wanted to send me flowers. She asked that I return her call. When I called her back she asked if we could meet up. We met for lunch. When the check came she made no move to look at it or even ask what her share would be. The server came by several times to process payment but seeing no credit card would leave. I felt uncomfortable as it dawned on me that she expected me to pay for her meal. I paid the check but am contemplating saying something to her if the opportunity arises. I realize that I should have said "We'll split the check down the middle." Would appreciate your thoughts.

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Joan Williams, Senior Talent Acquisition SpecialistMarch 9,2023 at 7:05PM UTC
I think the ship has sailed on this. She invited you, so she definitely should have picked up the check, but I don't see exactly what you have to gain by bringing it up after the fact.
Audrey KirschMarch 9,2023 at 7:22PM UTC
Since you didn't say anything when the check came, I'd say to chalk it up as a lesson learned and move on. Just don't make any more lunch plans unless you order and pay at the counter. You never know, she may reciprocate after she has a few paychecks and feels more secure in the position.
AnonymousMarch 9,2023 at 8:41PM UTC
O wow that was such a disrespectful move on her end to do. Everyone with basic socially dining etiquette manners knows that the person who " brought up the idea to go out to eat is the one who should be ready to pay for the meal in FULL, if not, at least their half. " So the fact that this person looked at you to pay for it as if it was YOUR idea to go out is messed up. Your anon so I wonder if you're a guy and the person was pulling the gender card here? Regardless, the same rule of, who asked who to lunch/dinner for the celebration should and would STILL apply. When it comes to you wanting to bring it up despite days passed. Given the circumstance and situation I would just let it go, be prepared for the next time the situation presents itself so you don't get placed in that uncomfortable position again.
AnonymousMarch 10,2023 at 5:37AM UTC
I'm also a female
AnonymousMarch 11,2023 at 7:12PM UTC
Just as a curiosity, is she much younger than you?
AnonymousMarch 9,2023 at 10:25PM UTC
It's a meal. Yes, when the server took the order, not sure why server didn't ask 1 or 2 checks today? That's a common practice to ask. IMO, I wouldn't ask, lesson learned? Or, how about the mindset of being, why not! Sure! I think it's not cool their assumption, but hey, you can be ok with it. Next time, next meal, next coffee, mention 2 checks up front to be clear to the server and not directed at your friend.
AnonymousMarch 10,2023 at 5:14AM UTC
Its actually not common practice for a server to ask 1 or 2 checks today. In fact most restaurants in my area have a "no separate check policy."
AnonymousMarch 10,2023 at 12:36PM UTC
Interesting, seems a bit unfair on the customers. Nothing like that around in my area for sure. Common practice in one area seems not a practice in others. thanks for sharing.
AnonymousMarch 9,2023 at 11:35PM UTC
Agreed. I just interject really quickly when they're just about to run off and get the check, and say, "Is it OK if we do 2 checks down the middle?" (the whole "is it OK?" is to keep things positive w/ the server... Demands aren't my modus operandis... I've worked several industries where I have learned over time what is effective to say... And what is not.
AnonymousMarch 10,2023 at 12:57PM UTC
I don't know if this applies, but I also wondered if this is a first-generation professional. These are some of the "unwritten" rules that people from middle and upper class backgrounds know and people from lower class (or immigrant - not synonymous) backgrounds might not. If you are a successful career woman, someone who sees you as a mentor might assume you are much better off financially and could better afford to pay without realizing they were making a misstep. An additional option would be to presume lack of knowledge rather than intended disrespect and at a later date invite her to lunch with the specific statement at the time of the invitation, "since I'm inviting you, lunch will be my treat." This would be a way to directly model the professional expectation. I wouldn't do this immediately, but maybe in a few months to see how she's doing in the program.
My daughter was recently talking to me about how difficult it is for her to make friends. A few random discussions have led her to the possibility that it is more about the lack of social mobility - for various reasons, my children were raised in poverty and I didn't manage to move back into the middle class until my oldest kids were in high school. They are doing quite well now (as am I), but their background doesn't match their professional colleagues and neighbors. They fit in professionally well enough because I taught them the things that I learned growing up middle class, so they know the unwritten norms and have me as a resource when they aren't sure. But they don't fit in socially very well because they know what it's like to be hungry and to live in a neighborhood with SWAT raids. Most people with their upbringing don't have a personal example or mentor, and small missteps like you describe can completely derail their progress even if they manage to break into the ground-level roles.
AnonymousMarch 10,2023 at 2:08PM UTC
I wouldn’t excuse such behaviour on the reasons you’ve given. Rather, in this situation especially, it seems more likely someone not being considerate, when it comes down to it. Particularly as the writer had done her a favour, for which she had expressed thanks. Wasn’t that the whole point of “inviting” her to lunch? Being generous, considerate, friendly, and all such are always more of a characteristic or personality trait than a class issue, as we all know and people will be themselves, wealthy or poor.
Now, to my main grouse here. I’m sorry, I don’t mean to attack, but to address the way immigrants have been “impliedly” classified here, as being of lower class. I’m a story teller, and I do know the power of words, so I could not let this go without a response, as statements like these add to the misinformation and presumptions about immigrants, which eventually impact negatively on “us”. I’m specifically concerned, knowing first hand, the prejudices and huddles stacked against immigrants in the job market. I suspect there are probably as many well educated, upper and middle class immigrants as there are lower class ones, but for some reason we would all be painted with that one brush?
Again, I felt my contribution was necessary - not upset about being categorized as lower class, but because of the effects of the wrongful presumptions.
We have to see less of stuff like these, please.
AnonymousMarch 10,2023 at 9:12PM UTC
My intent was that there are different expectations and standards among different cultures, so professional norms don't necessarily translate smoothly into American professional sensibilities. This is a different issue than people who come from lower socioeconomic families and communities who literally don't have a road map to the unwritten rules we tend to accept as basic rules within professional circles. We assume everyone knows them because we learned them informally through our family and community members. I apologize that I didn't clearly convey my thoughts.
Lisa MarieMarch 12,2023 at 5:35AM UTC
You're actually having a grouse with something that wasn't even implied about immigrants the way you think. You didn't understand what the commentor meant.
Madam anon663March 10,2023 at 2:35PM UTC
Excellent reply, and something we don't always consider. :)
AnonymousMarch 10,2023 at 3:15PM UTC
I second this is an excellent reply.
I believe we often are quick to judge and tend to think the worst of situations and people.
Does OP know what's going on in this woman's head or life? Maybe she had anxiety or just didn't realize.
If you think it was intentional, you could of communicated this at the lunch. I feel this all boils down to lack of communication.
Why not at the restaurant say "shall we split the check?" Or I'll pay if you leave the tip? Anything. It happened but don't overthink it. Don't let it happen again by communicating. Peace & Love
AnonymousMarch 10,2023 at 3:22PM UTC
A very well written and thought provoking reply, and I appreciate your making the distinction between lower class “or immigrant - not synonymous”.
Afo Ogbeyalu KaluMarch 11,2023 at 1:59PM UTC
Respectfully, courtesy/demonstrating thanks and appreciation is not a socio-economic class issue, it's a values/cultural/rearing/home-training issue.
Lori CasoMarch 10,2023 at 1:58PM UTC
Just curious - Did she ever send you flowers?
If she did, then maybe she felt she had already made a gesture.
If she never followed- thru on the flowers and then stiffed you with the check, you might want to hold back on any future recommendations for this entitled person.
AnonymousMarch 10,2023 at 3:24PM UTC
Who care about flowers? The person doing the inviting pays the bill
AnonymousMarch 11,2023 at 12:25AM UTC
She didn't send me flowers.
AnonymousMarch 11,2023 at 4:44PM UTC
I think she used you
AnonymousMarch 13,2023 at 6:08AM UTC
Yep
AnonymousMarch 10,2023 at 3:23PM UTC
No need to analyze. She comes off as a spoiled brat entitled person without any values or morals.
I would not help her in any way in the future, cut off ties and never take up the offer to meet and move on.
prople like this are not worth the precious energy. She’s jerking you around. Cut off contact and don’t help out ever again. Karma will work on her. Just see this experience as an unfortunate incident. Lesson learned and made you wiser who you trust
AnonymousMarch 10,2023 at 3:26PM UTC
I feel you are judging this woman on this one negative interaction. You must know her pretty well to recommend her for this opportunity. Why so quick to change your opinion about her because she didn't pay for lunch?
I vote live and let live. Stuff happens. She probably is unaware that you felt this way. It could have been an honest mistake.
I wouldn't think twice about it.
Annetta MosesMarch 10,2023 at 6:35PM UTC
She may have felt since you were the more senior employee you would pay for the meal.
I think you could have asked to split the check. I also think when she invited you to lunch you could have asked are if she was paying since she invited you. This would have allowed you to understand her expectations up front.
Live and learn.
AnonymousMarch 10,2023 at 7:54PM UTC
She showed her true colors. Why blame the person who recommended her? Many time we strive to be a better person, a friend, colleague but to have the person who got the promotion, ask the person out to lunch to thank her then not pay the bill is just WRONG
dont dismiss it as just a merely a bill. That is a testament to her character and the nerve she has
AnonymousMarch 10,2023 at 8:16PM UTC
If this wasn't a work-related lunch, it doesn't matter who the senior person is. In my opinion, if she invited you, she should've paid unless you offered to split it with her first.
RiaMarch 11,2023 at 12:24AM UTC
Agree
Crystal HowellMarch 11,2023 at 11:41AM UTC
Wow, tacky. Hopefully she does a good job. Nothing to say, you know her now. Decline any meetups or upfront say dutch. If you ask someone out, you pay. Etiquette is not her strong suit.
AnonymousMarch 11,2023 at 1:11PM UTC
Instead of being annoyed after the fact, when the waiter came, the problem could have been solved with “two checks, please!” Problem solved without any lingering bad feelings
AnonymousMarch 13,2023 at 6:07AM UTC
If you read the OP post she states she realizes she should have requested separate checks.
AnonymousMarch 11,2023 at 1:26PM UTC
This feels petty.
Lisa MarieMarch 12,2023 at 5:21AM UTC
Yep. I agree... I hear a little "petty bell" tinkling quietly around a corner.
How come the OP is brave enough to share this wiith us, perfect strangers, but not genuine enough to simply say even jokingly "girl, you better not be thinking I'm paying all of this bill by myself."
Something is amis ?
AnonymousMarch 13,2023 at 6:06AM UTC
Nothing petty about the OP. Its obvious why someone would feel more courageous posting ANONYMOUSLY in a group for opinions as opposed to directly confronting someone in person. Sometimes you don't know how you will react to something when you're in the moment. This is supposed to be a supportive forum and derisive comments like yours are not helpful. Nothing petty about a member who has experienced an uncomfortable scenario and asks for advice.
AnonymousMarch 11,2023 at 1:28PM UTC
It may seem like a trivial thing on the surface, but from now on I would keep interactions to coffee only. Your coworker is rude. You don’t ask someone to lunch and not at least offer to pay. I don’t care what your background is. It’s etiquette 101. Live and learn
AnonymousMarch 11,2023 at 1:36PM UTC
Too late to say something now. In the moment, it could've been addressed with a simple do you want to split it down the middle or Venmo me for your portion?
AnonymousMarch 11,2023 at 1:56PM UTC
She wanted to thank you for the recommendation, she invited you to lunch, and she expected you to pay? I must be missing something. She certainly needs to learn something about basic etiquette.
Debbie CachatMarch 11,2023 at 2:03PM UTC
When I invite someone to lunch coffee or dinner of course I pay- people with basic etiquette know that but some people don’t know or don’t care . If someone I work with invites me to lunch - I always keep it in the back of my head I might have to pay then I quickly decide if the relationship is important enough to me that I would want to pay - if it’s not I graciously decline the invite and no one’s feelings are hurt!
AnonymousMarch 11,2023 at 2:06PM UTC
This could also be a coaching moment. While I wouldn’t ask for her portion of the lunch back I would consider educating her on etiquette. Some people just don’t know any better and need to be taught. Now, the flowers thing makes me wonder if she’s just full of sh*t.
AnonymousMarch 13,2023 at 6:02AM UTC
Agree
AnonymousMarch 11,2023 at 2:21PM UTC
I think that this is on you for not speaking up about splitting the bill in the moment. I think the opportunity here is to speak to yourself about how you can handle a situation like this in the future if you find yourself in it again. We are only in control of what we do.
Michelle S.March 11,2023 at 3:07PM UTC
I mean, the right thing was for her to pay for it since she wanted to meet up and if you’re the one who suggested lunch, she could’ve easily said that she didn’t have the money for that. I think it’s one of those things that you should chalk up to, hopefully, it was just her having a very thoughtless day.
Lisa MarieMarch 11,2023 at 3:51PM UTC
Not being judgemental, but I'm curious as to why didn't you say something when it was time to pay?
Please use this as an experience to learn and grow from... speak up/advocate for yourself at all times. Never leave yourself in a position where you are at a disadvantage unnecessarily.
Now, IF/WHEN you speak with your associate, be sure toet her know that you expected she would have paid her part of the check. Please be aware that some folks can be truly innocently oblivious to things that others treat as "a norm."
Mary Mathiowetz-ShafferMarch 11,2023 at 4:06PM UTC
Leave it be - you’re a little wiser than before… ;)
Pauline Ker LeBlancMarch 11,2023 at 4:29PM UTC
I wonder if she assumed you would expense it to the/your company (sorry I can't tell if you work together or are in higher education?) some people are misinformed about these things and make assumptions. Agreed it is an awkward conversation about the bill at the end of a meal - but lesson learned it pays to address these things head on and in the specific moment.
AnonymousMarch 13,2023 at 6:01AM UTC
This was not a work related lunch nor was the recommendation work related.
1stBossLadyMarch 11,2023 at 5:00PM UTC
She's thinking that because of the help you've given, you're "ushering" her into this industry, "hosting" her, so to speak, taking her under your wing... You get my point. She felt the lunch was just another way that you're "mentoring" her. Please set the record straight before she expects this at every encounter.
AyianMarch 11,2023 at 5:08PM UTC
If you have lunch with them again, try something like 'Okay, you can get the check this time!' It's an easy, low-confrontation way to open communication about contributing to shared expenses.
AnonymousMarch 11,2023 at 6:06PM UTC
Oh definitely do send her a note and ask her to reimburse you by check for the cost of her meal. Let her know that while you are happy to help her that did not include her gratitude lunch at your expense.
Lisa MarieMarch 11,2023 at 9:39PM UTC
No. Sending notes asking for reimbursement will be petty. Big time. This is how good friendships can get soured unnecessarily.
Have you never done something and when you replay the events in your mind, you see where you could/should have done things differently/better?
This is one of those moments, which doesn't need any help getting more sour.
Sometimes WE teach ourselves lessons too... and this is one of those situations where the OP should/will be learning how to react in a future situation such as that one?
Erica ZMarch 12,2023 at 1:58AM UTC
That would be petty and mean. We don’t know why she didn’t offer to at least split the check, perhaps she lacked funds, perhaps she misunderstood and thought she was being treated to a congratulatory lunch.
AnonymousMarch 12,2023 at 3:27AM UTC
It is better to ask next time who is sponsoring rather than souring the friendship this time.
Jeda HiggsMarch 12,2023 at 12:00AM UTC
Also, is she broke just entering this program? Courtesy-wise, if you asked for lunch to treat her, of course you’d pay. How very awkward! But agree, that it’s a learning opportunity. I’m unapologetically out front with what I can afford, but I can understand the awkwardness of the situation. I would never ask for someone to reimburse a lunch afterward. That just creates unnecessary bad blood and it’s not worth it.
AnonymousMarch 13,2023 at 6:00AM UTC
She suggested lunch.
Liz MilneMarch 12,2023 at 1:58AM UTC
If you suggested lunch when she asked you to meet up, she maybe thinks you wanted to take her out to celebrate her success? Think about how the conversation went - if she said 'lunch' first, then, yes, she should have paid or mentioned sharing the bill; but if you said it, then that onus is on you, imo...
AnonymousMarch 13,2023 at 6:00AM UTC
She suggested lunch.
Rondinella OlsenMarch 12,2023 at 3:02PM UTC
I always assume the check will be split unless it has been stated “let me take you out for lunch”. If you said let’s meet for lunch or let’s do lunch it means we are splitting the bill. I would mention it if the opportunity arises but just in general. If this person assumes they will be treated to lunch each time they are invited it’s going to create many awkward moments and can even hurt their career.
AnonymousMarch 12,2023 at 6:15PM UTC
Correct except she didn't even bother to pay for her own share of the lunch
Focused931221March 13,2023 at 3:28AM UTC
There's really no point in bringing it up... unless you are meeting up with her to have lunch again. In which case, you can ask if she'll be treating since you got the tab last time? I guess I'm not sure why she thought you would pick up the tab to begin with and then you actually did pay it; so now a precedent has been set. Did she ask you out to lunch? Or did you suggest lunch when she said "meet up"? I guess there are clues in the details but this is all after the fact. I would try to move on and not spend too much of your energy on this.
AnonymousMarch 13,2023 at 5:59AM UTC
She suggested lunch.