Hi looking for advice.

39 Comments

1. AnonymousOctober 31,2022 at 6:58PM UTC

   Speak with a career coach or maybe a mentor.

2. AnonymousOctober 31,2022 at 7:16PM UTC

   There can be many different reasons for laid off. Fired is something else. As far as good reviews, it could be either doing well or the manager did not want the baggage associated with explaining poor performance and setting up a performance improvement plan (PIP). The best way to get constructive feedback is by contacting a career coach or mentor (like prior poster stated). That way you will be able to talk through what you are seeing. The coach/mentor can ask probing questions to clarify what you are seeing and give feedback. As far as layoff/fired events: it may not be the skills you have but interactions among people that cause getting fired. Perhaps others are not understanding your communications as you think they are being sent. That would also be a topic suggestion for your coach/mentor.

3. AnonymousOctober 31,2022 at 7:50PM UTC

   Your situation is more common than you might think. Sometimes a former co-worker might open up rather than a supervisor. You might also consider consulting work. It can be less relational and strong project completion is usually rewarded. You are asking the right questions which is a good start. Good luck.

4. Julie HumbirdOctober 31,2022 at 9:33PM UTC

   This could have nothing to do with you at all. Some organizations cut tech jobs or 'relocate' them to countries where they can pay far less. This has been getting more common over the past decade and also due to COVID. I agree with the comments regarding looking for consulting work at well-established tech organizations (think World Wide Technology). Find a position where you are client-billable and not just and overhead cost.

5. Sunny DaysOctober 31,2022 at 11:26PM UTC

   I am in IT and I have seen things like that happen when organizations want to save money by thinking they can get the same out of someone less expensive or give out IT careers like charity to some exec's unqualified nephew.
   They usually hire correctly after a few expensive mistakes. Also IT seems to have become more cut throat in the last decade if you ask me. I have noticed ridiculously inappropriate attempts to save money on IT salaries also.

6. AnonymousNovember 1,2022 at 4:36AM UTC

   I agree with others: your ongoing layoffs/firings could have multiple causes:

   -Industry instability.

   -Working for unstable companies.

   -Interpersonal problems of which you are unaware.

   Repeated firings suggests that you might be rubbing people the wrong way, even though they appreciate your technical skills. Working with a coach is one way to work through this.

   You also might contrast your relationships in the companies in which you’ve been laid off versus the companies from which you’ve been fired. Are there certain types of people, organizations and situations that are great for you? And are there any commonalities surrounding your firings?

   A few things that you have going for you: you have good performance reviews and you’ve always gone on to find additional work. It’s apparent that you are qualified and competent, and that some folks like you just fine.

7. AnonymousOctober 31,2022 at 11:39PM UTC

   What specific job function are you pursuing and are you mostly applying to small companies or contract positions?
   If so, try aiming for companies that have been around for 30+ yrs that survived a depression or two and a mid size to large company. You can also apply to give vet agencies. No the pa is not the same as govt, but once you’re in, you’re not as likely to be subject to layoffs

8. Jackie GhedineNovember 1,2022 at 11:06AM UTC

   If you are part of a layoff, it could have nothing to do with you specifically.
   It could be job elimination or consolidation. If you are being 'fired' are they not putting you on performance improvement plans? This is the usual protocol for organizations to protect themselves.

   I would suggest hiring a coach, (not because I am one) but because having a third party to support you and improve your performance can make a world of difference. We are too close ourselves to be objective, notice nuances and make adjustments.

   As a mid-life coach for working women, this is a time where many women begin to reflect on what they want next and purposefully plan how to get there instead of letting their history dictate their future. This shift is freeing and exciting for women!

9. AnonymousNovember 2,2022 at 5:22AM UTC

   Thanks! I have never been on a PIP and have not received verbal feedback that suggested I was rubbing people the wrong way, but that’s worth looking at. I’ll look into a coach.

   I’m not in HR but always thought they would get involved to share feedback if I was rubbing someone the wrong way. But surely a situational conflict at work isn’t grounds for firing?

10. Jackie GhedineNovember 3,2022 at 8:00PM UTC

    HR doesn't get involved enough and there are so many things happening they are unaware of in orgs. I am a coach for women 40+ and would like to offer you a free 30-minute session. You can reach out to me at jackie@moderngenxwoman.com

11. AnonymousNovember 1,2022 at 12:10PM UTC

    IT in the last 5 years has been always the first dept to get laid off during economic hard times, especially devops and support roles. It is one of the the most expensive dept and companies are always looking to outsource or cutback on “unnecessary” head count so it might not have anything to do with you if your appraisals are solid. If you think it is you, you may want to build a relationship with someone you trust to see if it is something about your personality/style but I would think it is more about budget cuts.

12. Yaneke D. KeiseNovember 1,2022 at 12:26PM UTC

    It really may not be you but more so company decision to save money. As others have said IT continues to be a department that gets cut when efficiencies need to be made.

    I would suggest look for roles that position you as an invaluable employee. Positions that only you or a handful of people can do, and that will be required regardless of potential layoffs.

    I would continue to stay positive. Since it honestly doesn’t sound like these decisions are a result of your work.

13. GirlBossanova934974November 1,2022 at 12:31PM UTC

    As a person who has worked in IT for around a dozen years and has been in the workforce for several decades, I don't believe the problem is you. The problem is the places you have chosen to work at. It remains to be proven that the problems can be attributed to the Tech Sector. One should give serious pause when you are getting good performance reviews and then getting shown the door shortly thereafter. We should not excuse this sort of aberrant behavior or look the other way. Good managers and companies don't do these sorts of things. You know where you stand. If it were me, I would do a lot more careful research on the companies I interview with going forward. Serious and probing questions should be asked of your perspective employer. And while you are at that, I would go online and look for customer and employee reviews of the company in question. Usually these sort of revolving door companies leave a long trail of unhappy customers and employees. You can also go on LinkedIn and look at profiles of company employees. If the vast majority of employees have been there for less than 2 years, it is usually the sign of a revolving door. The evidence is out there.

14. AnonymousNovember 1,2022 at 12:52PM UTC

    I am not sure when you say mid-career your age, but please not the Following info I pulled off the Cornell Law School website.
    I Know it doesn't answer your question about how to obtain constructive feedback but it does allow you to understand some rights.

    I am not an attorney and I am simply passing along info easily found on the internet and the EEOC website. In cases of legal matters always consult with an expert in the field - the State Bar association for your state will be able to assist you with finding attorneys who specialize in specific fields and provide any information on disciplinary action that has been taken against an attorney.

    If you are over 40 you are allowed 21 days to review the severance package and any legal documents your company wants you to sign.

    If two or more employees are over 40 and being let go the rules get even more specific and the days go from 21 to 45 before you have to sign anything. Now you are also entitled to a list of those let go at the same time - You wont know names, but they have to provide job title, gender, and age, but you will also have to be provided the ages of all of those in the same group not being let go.

    In 1990, Congress amended the Age Discrimination in Employment Act (ADEA), adding the Older Workers Benefit Protection Act (OWBPA) to clarify the prohibitions against discrimination on the basis of age. The OWBPA is a federal law that requires employers to offer older workers (those who are at least 40 years old) benefits that are equal to or, in some cases, cost the employer as much as, the benefits it offers to younger workers. The OWBPA also sets minimum standards for an employee waiver of the right to sue for age discrimination, designed to ensure that the waiver is knowing and voluntary. Under the Older Workers Benefit Protection Act, employees over 40 are entitled to various employee benefits such as severance pay and cannot be pressured into signing legal waivers. It establishes specific requirements for a “knowing and voluntary” release of ADEA claims to guarantee that an employee has every opportunity to make an informed choice whether or not to sign the waiver. It acts as a safety net to ensure older and vulnerable workers aren’t unfairly laid off from work and don’t experience age discrimination.

15. AnonymousNovember 2,2022 at 1:22AM UTC

    This is jibberish, and it has zero correlation to the OP’s question! Why does everyone on this board jump to litigation anytime there’s a work place hiccup?

    This woman said Nothing about age discrimination, she said getting laid off or fired has become a pattern.

    Please ladies, let’s help each other to get out of this perpetual victim status.

16. AnonymousNovember 2,2022 at 9:20PM UTC

    She did say mid career and I acknowledged it immediately in my reply. Mid career usually indicates someone over forty. Never did I advocate litigation. I advocated knowing your rights. She has no idea of why she is laid off. If over 40 she does have some rights afforded her that do not pertain to those under 40 including knowing more about who was laid off with you including their ages.

17. Melissa NobileNovember 1,2022 at 12:58PM UTC

    My sister is also in IT.
    She got laid off once, and has since has learned to watch the finances of the company like a hawk. As soon as things start to head south, she looks to jump ship.
    Next time you get hired, find the finance reports. Watch how the company is doing overall. Watch the trends. If they head south, look for a new job. If you time it well, you can ask them to lay you off, take the severance, and start your new job without them ever knowing of the layoff.

18. AnonymousNovember 1,2022 at 1:26PM UTC

    I am an accountant by trade and I whole-heartedly agree with knowing the financial condition of the company. If the companies you have been working for are public, - easy to get to the financials and expert opinion on the condition of the company. Also, encourage you to attend the quarterly earnings call, scan the 10Q, etc. . If not public, a bit more difficult but there are signs even if the financial condition is held close to the vest. Highly suggest a "friend" in accounting as guess who is usually the first to know there is a problem with profitability? Also, ask your managers on a regular basis how the company is performing; ask if the latest project brought in the revenue it was projected to bring in, be curious. Assuming they do budgets, ask about the budget for the next year and what growth is expected - top line (revenue) and bottom line (expense / net operating income); If you see a hiring freeze - you need to get ready as after they freeze they go for current staff to cut costs; Do people seem overworked / does the place seem to be understaffed? Are investments in technology and other efforts being delayed or "paused?" You are in tech - do you see that the company pushes upgrades and licensing to the back burner? Are they stingy with licenses when it appears they should be granting them for business need? Look for the clues and you'll have a heads up. Agree with another poster to read online reviews of the company as well. Keep your reviews - I send mine home. You should be able to prove it isn't you. If they do a layoff - are you the only person being let go? If so, there may be more to it. If not, it is likely a financial decision. And continue to ask - why me, how was my role selected, etc. Good luck on your next role and keep your eyes open!

19. AnonymousNovember 3,2022 at 9:22PM UTC

    SO helpful as regards the financial health.
    And YES! In this case - there have been multiple freezes, losses of businesses licenses, multiple execs jumping ship that had been there 20 years.
    i will learn to ask these more pointed questions of smaller companies or startups if I decide to stay in the this industry.

    I also wish there was a better way to truly understand a company culture before accepting an offer. Glassdoor reviews only get you so far if you don’t know anyone that works there to ask

20. Diana SchneidmanNovember 1,2022 at 1:57PM UTC

    You are not meant for corporate employment. Start a freelance or consulting practice immediately. It appears you have contacts at several companies who understand in depth what you do and get along with you. Ask for networking help.

    You will never know the problem but the "problem" is most likely something good. For instance: you worked yourself up to a high salary they don't want to continue paying. Someone is jealous of your effectiveness on the job. You get more done than your coworkers, making them look lazy or whiny in comparison.

    No use looking for sex or age discrimination. The numbers won't prove anything decisive and you have no stories to back up your claim. A waste of time that will keep you upset about something that will not bear fruit. Anyway, it probably would be classified as "corporate culture," not actionable discrimination.

    You are meant to be self-employed. The beauty of self-employment is that even if a client decides they no longer want to work with you, you always have other clients and are continually marketing to get more.

    Starting your own business is something you can get excited about. Worrying about what is wrong with you when you have not a clue is simply depressing.

21. AnonymousNovember 7,2022 at 11:03PM UTC

    Thanks! I don’t totally agree that I’m not suited for corporate employment but am interested in your suggestion of freelance or consulting work. Any recommendations on platforms to look for these gigs? I was horrified by the low / poverty rate pay I learned about from the big nationwide agencies.

22. Shelby CNovember 1,2022 at 2:16PM UTC

    Some people aren't "corporate" people. There is NOTHING wrong with that. You should consider branching out on your own and testing the water with some freelance work to see if you find it fulfilling. If you do, there is your answer.

23. AnonymousNovember 1,2022 at 3:50PM UTC

    keep asking

24. froerden@yahoo.comNovember 1,2022 at 4:11PM UTC

    I'm sorry to hear that you are having this problem.
    I have it too. I have had several jobs that ended unexpectedly, without having any big problems, discipline issues, or verbal or written warnings. I wish I had the answer to your question, but I don't. As a small consolation, please know that it is not only happening to you.

25. AnonymousNovember 2,2022 at 5:17AM UTC

    Thank you! Have you been able to glean anything useful from your own experiences?

26. AnonymousNovember 2,2022 at 10:28PM UTC

    No, not really. I asked and then politely demanded (several times) an answer from management as to why I was being let go. I got a vague mumble about upper management and the client. This is after getting great review, a raise in July, a bonus and nothing but compliments from the people who live at the property I managed. I am just moving on.

27. AnonymousNovember 1,2022 at 8:31PM UTC

    What is your specific role within the tech industry? As a fellow tech industry veteran, certain roles are seen as more “disposable” by upper management and more prone to job cuts. (Typically, these are roles in the testing/support/training/documentation areas.) I’ve worked at companies that cut their entire testing and technical documentation teams before laying off a single engineer.

28. Megan JohnstonNovember 2,2022 at 3:04AM UTC

    I noticed a few things in your post that might bring up some things to reflect on. I am interested by your description of the companies you usually work at as competitive environments. My experience is that isn't that common in tech. I'm curious to understand what makes you describe the environments you have been in this way? Performance goals aren't everything, being too goal oriented can sometimes come at the expense of relationships. How are your relationships? What are the top three words you think the teams you have been on recently would use to describe you?

29. AnonymousNovember 2,2022 at 5:14AM UTC

    Funny we just did this exercise. The three words that came back consistently for me were “collaborative, pleasant, curious”. I would also describe myself with these words.

    Interested that you haven’t found tech industry too competitive. My experience has been dead-opposite but perhaps it’s the function I’m in.

30. AnonymousNovember 2,2022 at 4:51PM UTC

    The word "pleasant" seems to be a euphemism for "passive" or someone who doesn't speak up. I have an elderly neighbor who I sometimes check in on and whenever I call her she talks non-stop and never gives me a chance to talk. I figure that's what she needs so I just let her ramble on and on. She said I was pleasant. In this situation, I don't care but if someone said that to me in a professional environment I would worry. It might indicate that you come across as a people-pleaser, a follower (not a leader), or someone with no personality or self-confidence. I've found that publicly praising coworkers and trying to make insightful comments in meetings helps people to see you as positive and confident.

    Good luck! I hope your next job is the perfect fit for you!

31. AnonymousNovember 2,2022 at 6:23PM UTC

    FWIW, I’ve also found the tech industry to be fairly competitive, especially at companies that do stacked ranking of employees or have mandatory numbers for “Unregretted Attrition”.

    I’ve seen some great workers forced out in those circumstances simply just because they were the newest person on the team or ran into bad luck with ending up on a bad project.

32. AnonymousNovember 2,2022 at 3:45AM UTC

    I think you should talk to those close to you that can help you understand yourself and your interpersonal skills. You might be very out of touch with yourself.

33. Rocky SalimNovember 2,2022 at 1:00PM UTC

    it's usually difficult for leaders to talk about the real reasons for terminations to avoid liability or conflict with federal laws. often terminations are simply the result of corporate cost-cutting in which every department has to give up its pound of flesh.

    so is it possible that you are the problem? maybe. it takes some harsh self-reflection to know whether you are in the right role and to be honest about your strengths and weaknesses. engaging mentors is key to completing this journey and should be done long before there is any danger of losing the job. find your tribe and embrace the tough love.

    that said, there is a bigger risk for you. you can be developing some negativity because of these experiences and most leaders view negativity as a cancer that needs to be removed at first opportunity. you must do whatever it takes to create a positive and optimistic mindset in spite of the trauma you have experienced. therapy is for everyone, not just "crazy" people. dell allows me to use education dollars for dale carnegie courses and i believe something like that could be life changing for you, not just in your current role but in releasing the leader within you.

    i can tell by your statements that you genuinely care about doing a good job and that you are awesome. believe it and smile. positivity is very powerful.

34. AnonymousNovember 2,2022 at 2:43PM UTC

    How about finding a small IT consulting company? I think the message should be avoid large corporate. Freelance is probably not going to work because it relies on people skills heavily.

35. AnonymousNovember 2,2022 at 6:14PM UTC

    You might consider rewarding your ask for feedback. Instead of asking what you are doing wrong, consider reaching out to former colleagues and state that you are reassessing what constitutes your ideal employment and ask them what they feel you should strongly lean towards and what you should consider trying to avoid. That would give people the opportunity for feedback without them directly and specifically addressing a problematic area.

36. Bradford McCormickNovember 2,2022 at 8:16PM UTC

    If you are getting soid written reviews, and more important, if you know in your heart h=you are doing good work (yes?), and they are not telling yo usomething, shen isn't that telling you something -- abou them?

    his sounds like you nave aproblem: with them. They are the problem. But is ther anything you an do abou tit except for the obvious (go elsewhere).

    Maybe yu don't schmooze enough. Maybe you don't look like teh or talk like them? Maybe you don't really like them and they suspect hey are not all that likeable?

    eing right sometimes jsu sets you up for the on esur reward for virtue: itself ("Virtue is its own reward", bu that don't pay the rent). Not all people are nice especially those with smiles on their faces (See the old soul song "Smiling faces sometimes" by The Undisputed Truth, free on Youtube)

    Maybbe you're too good for them but taht does not help you? It's unlikely anyody on the oh=utside can help although maybe a close friend -- a real friennd -- migh have a clue since they can empathize with you but hav e"distance" from your situaiton. I read yesterday about somebody who got fires becaue their coworkers did not like what they smelled (olefactory) like.

    You'e ask and they're not telling. Maybe they're plotting behind yu, or maybe they don't have a clue themselves. An information network does not need consciousness to develop.

37. AnonymousNovember 2,2022 at 10:40PM UTC

    Maybe you need to put down the martini before you respond to posts!

38. AnonymousNovember 3,2022 at 1:15AM UTC

    I think in your case it could be a combination of the industry and economy, when you have time try to research your specific niche. But look at data that reflects the progress from the past 40 yrs to current. If you tend to work for small businesses or contract only work, that is not necessarily as stable as working in a larger organization, that has been around for 30+ yrs. Try to focus on companies that have longevity, especially in volatile markets or economic downturns. Try applying to govt agencies. Although they do not pay corporate pay, they offer longevity and stability. Try usajobs.gov

39. AnonymousNovember 3,2022 at 9:37AM UTC

    With good and solid performance reviews, and this still happening, it tells me that you didn't connect with people, and maybe that is the reason why when needing to choose someone to lay off, they would choose someone that they don't feel close too.