I was asked to be a support person by a friend or colleague for a meeting to discuss their professionalism.

Anonymous

March 3,2022 at 9:33AM UTC

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I was asked to be a support person by a friend or colleague for a meeting to discuss their professionalism. Our employer had some valid points however it all seemed quiet blown up out of proportion. Today they were given a letter of concern from our employer advising her of the issues and to come to the meeting with a support person. After reading the letter I advised to go in with her lawyer instead of myself. But what is really concerning me is our employer is a highly literate person with a history degree. This letter read like a rant of petty issues. It had spelling, grammatical errors and inconsistencies, as well as being badly constructed, sections obviously cut and pasted. It just didn't read like they had written it. Should I feel concerned about the mental state of my employer?

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Lanette RigginsMarch 3,2022 at 9:45AM UTC
You should be concerned however the ill composed letter serves as great evidence against her manager.
As you recommended, she should go see an employment lawyer and start documenting every interaction she has with her manager and if possible continue having other people present when they interact so she has a witness. Also go see HR or someone in upper management to file a complaint.
AnonymousMarch 3,2022 at 12:06PM UTC
This is not meant to be disrespectful but taking an employment attorney into a corrective action meeting seems extreme. Is there an opportunity to work on some of these issues before throwing a grenade at an ant hill? And I would challenge this person to think about how much they want to remain in the role before shelling out hundreds of dollars an hour for a legal retainer.
Madam anon663March 4,2022 at 2:19PM UTC
But sending an illiterate letter, and asking for a support person to be brought seems extreme to me. I would be looking for another job asap. This company sounds awful if that is how they communicate.
Beth ConsugarMarch 3,2022 at 2:13PM UTC
Is there an HR person? If so, that is probably the best person to go with her instead of a lawyer.
If there is no HR, a lawyer may be the right answer.
The letter advised she bring a “support person”? Maybe that isn’t you. I have never heard that before.
I would be concerned about what is happening and would consider looking for a new job soon.
Lesa Edwards, Career Coach & Master Resume WriterMarch 3,2022 at 4:10PM UTC
An HR person from that company would be of no use to Anonymous, as he/she would be firmly on the side of the company (which, presumably, would translate to the boss).
AnonymousMarch 4,2022 at 1:52PM UTC
HR here, and I agree with the other person that replied in the sense that we are not there to be a support person for the meeting.
It’s not that we would necessarily only be there for the company, but that we are not to take sides. We would only document what was said in the meeting. If the company is saying she needs someone there for support, HR would then be seen as the representative for the employee, which would not be in the best interest of either the employee or the manager.
I’ve never heard of a company advising the employee to bring support, but I would imagine it would need to be someone that has seen the employee work, knows their work ethic, and can speak to specific instances that the manager may bring up.
Jennifer KlinkoMarch 4,2022 at 2:16PM UTC
HR would be the LAST person to ask. HR works for the company.
Michelle RhodesBrownMarch 4,2022 at 2:38PM UTC
HR is very clearly working on behalf of the company. I would absolutely not use HR for this purpose, they do not have the employee's best interest in mind.
AnonymousMarch 4,2022 at 1:16PM UTC
It maybe time to begin exploring options for new employment. It seems as if the employer may be preparing to manage this person out.
Orlagh CostelloMarch 4,2022 at 1:16PM UTC
A support person is par for the course in Ireland, in fact I think it's a requirement that people be given the opportunity to bring someone as support in any formal engagement with their employer. But the letter is usually a standard one, basically outlining the employer wants to meet with the person at X time to discuss certain issues and the employee has the right to bring someone with them. Usually here, if you're a union member, you bring a union rep. Even if you're not a union member, you can always bring a union rep, although they are not representing the union in that meeting. HR are going to be no good as a support person in that meeting and a lawyer wouldn't be usual at all. If the letter has spelling & grammatical errors, that's bad enough, but inconsistencies is almost a get out of jail free card cos the employer is basically contradicting themselves. Very strange to see one of those letters with basic mistakes like that.
Lori CasoMarch 4,2022 at 3:38PM UTC
Wow, I did not know this about Ireland, how interesting.
Orlagh CostelloMarch 4,2022 at 8:06PM UTC
Unions are the default here for non-management roles & employees' rights much stronger than what I see in the US.
AnonymousMarch 4,2022 at 1:55PM UTC
Don't be the support person unless mentoring is among your listed duties. This person should get legal counsel. A paralegal or mediator accompaniment would be less expensive than an attorney if this person doesn't feel she can hold her own.
AnonymousMarch 5,2022 at 7:10AM UTC
A paralegal would NOT be a good alternative to an attorney. Paralegals are not licensed to give legal advice, those who do are practicing law without a license.
Ellen Smith FaganMarch 4,2022 at 1:59PM UTC
The employer wants to make a formal business of this scenario, and amp up the emotional/psychological aspect by suggesting the employee show up with a support person.
If the issue not WWIII, why does a decent employee need to show up with an advocate? IF you have been doing your day as a normal part of the work team, your human rights should be okay to just chat it out with the boss without fear.
The boss’ escalation of the “moment” is BAD NEWS. But at least half the time, by the day of the meeting the issue is such old news that the meeting is defused.
IF your instinct is telling you that this moment is not a passing thing- yes- you may be happier and more productive and successful working somewhere else, but let it be by YOUR initiative and.
AnonymousMarch 4,2022 at 2:04PM UTC
Yes, stay out of drama. Keep your head down. And possibly, think about looking around.
Maggie StoneMarch 4,2022 at 2:12PM UTC
This whole situation seems odd to me. First, I have never heard of anyone else other than a Manager/ Supervisor or HR being in a corrective action or termination meeting. I am not sure what they mean by a “support person”, but I agree it’s not an attorney or HR. If the letter lists the complaints and doesn’t mention development of some performance improvement plan, it seems like this is more a termination meeting, rather than a corrective action meeting. And it was probably written in haste because the employer wanted to provide a hasty warning. So I would advise your colleague to document everything, particularly if this might potentially end in wrongful termination.
Ruth A. Ford, PHRMarch 4,2022 at 3:22PM UTC
Right? I was thinking the poster/author must not be in the U.S. -- this definitely doesn't sound like the usual workings of U.S. employment law and/or HR.
Lorna Rose, J.D., M.S.March 5,2022 at 11:50PM UTC
The “support person” thing is nothing more than the employer’s way of making sure that an impartial witness is present during a termination meeting
Ruth A. Ford, PHRMarch 7,2022 at 7:07PM UTC
Yes, I understand that. Just making the point that an employee having a "support person" of their choosing in any sort of work or performance related matter does not sound like a standard practice in American HR management.
Jennifer KlinkoMarch 4,2022 at 2:19PM UTC
Yes, you should be concerned. You could do endless speculating about the cause of these evident changes in your boss. It really doesn't matter though, all that matters is there is a change and it's not an improvement. Start exploring back up options.
Gargi BiswasMarch 4,2022 at 2:35PM UTC
I believe you should be concerned because the letter described by you looks like someone making out problems out of petty issues that can be spoken about and sorted. Someone who wants to create bigger problems rather than speaking and sorting them out, looks like an aggressive and insensitive person to me.
AnonymousMarch 4,2022 at 3:04PM UTC
it sounds like the employer hired someone to write the pre-termination letter inventing exaggerated distorted justifications to fire her for so-called misconduct.
Also sounds like employer wants another worker present as a witness FOR THE EMPLOYER at the termination meeting. Sounds like employer is afraid of an unemployment claim or afraid of being sued. If your workplace has a union and if your friend is not management, then your friend needs to bring her union rep. If not, I think your friend needs to look for another job ASAP. If your friend thinks this is because of her race, national origin, sex, pregnancy, age or other protected ground, she could call the EEOC. If your friend thinks it is because of discussing working conditions with colleagues and your friend is not management, she could call the NLRB. I was in your friend’s shoes once at a non-union workplace where the issue was not race, age, discussing working conditions, etc. Employer just disliked me. I even got the weird letter that included mistakes in my name that employer herself would not have made - she hired a consultant to write it. (Among other things, I used too many Post-It’s and I dressed weird.) I quit so as not to have a firing on my record. I got a better job promptly.
Karen DulaneyMarch 4,2022 at 3:21PM UTC
Curious to see how that plays out
Donnette ShawMarch 4,2022 at 3:49PM UTC
The meeting should be postponed until she can have her lawyer present. This seems like the employer wants to terminate her. Was she given other notices/memos of the said behaviors or is this her first meeting about them. This doesn’t seem like due process was followed.
AnonymousMarch 4,2022 at 4:22PM UTC
Wow. All I can say is wow.
Wanda ShawMarch 4,2022 at 5:37PM UTC
Grammatical errors and inconsistencies from a history major?
I don't want to sound petty myself., but this smacks of an unprofessional rant, so I'd tread very lightly. If you can get HR involved that would be great. When a written communication is not proofed or checked for accuracies, it's bad news. Just my opinion of course
AnonymousMarch 4,2022 at 11:09PM UTC
yes, be concerned. pettiness knows no boundary.
AnonymousMarch 5,2022 at 4:38AM UTC
Thank you everyone for the advice. She is bringing a union rep to the meeting. I also advised her to document everything, and prepare an exit plan. As for me I agree about keeping my head down and looking to my own exit plan.
Laura Ann KleinMarch 5,2022 at 5:41AM UTC
Best of luck to you in this difficult situation.
AnonymousMarch 5,2022 at 7:20PM UTC
So glad there’s a union rep to go with her.
Hopefully she’s got some protection under the contract.
Stephanie LekowskiMarch 5,2022 at 1:58PM UTC
Yes, very much so. 1) The whole process, despite the "support person" issue, seems designed to intimidate your friend. 2) They're not treating employees with any professionalism yet are demanding it from their employees/accusing of it being lacking. If I were you, I would tell your friend to be prepared to be dismissed; they sound like they have their minds made up and are just trying to CTA/obey the minimum laws they need to. Both of you should get your resumes together and be ready to ask what will be said to a future employer. Protect yourselves.
Ellen Smith FaganMarch 5,2022 at 7:44PM UTC
I have only been in an office with a thing like this happening ONCE - it is bad in every way.
It is ludicrous that the employer criticizes your friend for her professionalism when employers know that such issues are resolved charmingly and respectfully , above all, it’s the law. Asking a third person to amp up the noise is really dangerous - You go to help your friend and you both drown. Stay out of it and tell your friend to get an attorney or ARBITRATOR - which is often nicer and allows things to get back to normal happily.
YES, do prepare for new jobs for you and your friend and file complaint with the Labor Department or thru your attorney about the scary scenario created by this unwise boss.
The constitution guarantees you freedom from all fears or undermined rights while you are trying to do your day’s work - and freedom from even the FEAR of reprisals when issues resolution is needed. STAY NICE - TWO WRONGS DO NOT MAKE A RIGHT, but the law is on your side if the boss is doing an inflammation instead of a resolution. You can claim damages, benefits etc…for the threats to your job.
BE GOOD AND YOU’LL BE HAPPY - so simple and yet people forget it, sometimes.
AnonymousMarch 10,2022 at 7:26PM UTC
Is it at all possible your employer did NOT write this letter, but someone else did and sent on behalf of the employer? If this uncharacteristic, o would be concerned. Was the meeting you sat in of the same tone - ranting, inconsistent, full of what sounds like rage? As everyone else mentioned- I would try to remove myself from the situation as much as I could but I would be ready to share what occurred with a union rep/attorney and hopefully HR. If your employer had something outside of work impacting their mental health I hope they are also able to get the help they may not realize they need. Best of luck. This sounds like a really yucky situation