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Anonymous

September 12,2022 at 7:14PM UTC

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Hello! Advice please. My old boss exited the company (he hired me and was then pushed out) about six months ago. Prior to his leaving I had a great performance review.

My (inherited) new boss wasn’t someone I was able to really jive with as she played favorites and was generally non-supportive and critical.

I was assigned to a project and did a great job - public thanks from an executive, etc. however my manager stopped meeting with me 1:1 about 2 months ago with no explanation. My projects started to wind down so I asked for more work and didn’t get any.

A month ago, My boss put a meeting on calendar and there was an HR rep on it with her. Mgr said she thought I “wasn’t happy” was offering me a PIP. I was shocked and frustrated, which I told both her and the HR rep. Mgr scoffed and told me I “knew about these items” - but the items she raised were never flagged to me as worthy of a PIP. I told her I disagreed and these items were simply conversations, I was not aware these were PiP-worthy.

my question is - what kind of obligation do the company and my manager have about notifying me about performance issues before a PIP? No one said a darn thing to me and the last thing I have to go on was this (great) performance review from a former manager. The written items named as problematic in the PIP are either factually incorrect or seem minor. HR is not interested in my seeking to correct the errors or providing guidance in any way on the triviality of these items.

Really seeking to understand what went wrong here. Is there anything pointed I can ask HR to shed some light?

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AnonymousSeptember 12,2022 at 7:25PM UTC
HR is not really there to explain the PIP. Your manager must do that.
I would accept the PIP and show evidence that the items have been addressed and your performance is on track.
HR is there to enforce your managers plan. Whether you agree with your manager's characterisation of the items as factual or correct is really between you and your manager. If she disagrees. you are now in the position of proving your performance has addressed these items and they have been fully resolved. In order to keep you job, you must turn this around and show you have proactively addressed them and they have been corrected.
Kristen SteinerSeptember 12,2022 at 9:42PM UTC
And then look for another position.
AnonymousSeptember 13,2022 at 9:00PM UTC
You want to search for a new job while you're employed so attempt to play nice with the PIP to stay employed while you look.
Nothing us worse than the stress of job searching and then adding the financial stress of being unemployed. It can lead to desperate decisions & accepting jobs that are unfit just to pay your bills.
AnonymousSeptember 12,2022 at 8:33PM UTC
Wow. This sounds exactly like something I went through. I am so sorry this happened to you! I know how you feel. I’m not saying what I did was the answer, but I did immediately start looking for another role, and I was hired before the 30 days were up. This makes me angry and should never be allowed, but it happens. This was 2 years ago, and I still hear from a former colleague about the hell she’s causing others.
Don’t take it personally. This is clearly her issue. Maybe she finds you a threat. That was my problem. I knew my job well and I was very good at it. I still am! Please keep us posted on what you decide to do.
AnonymousSeptember 12,2022 at 9:00PM UTC
Similar experience.. run!
AnonymousSeptember 13,2022 at 1:09AM UTC
Agreed ---- and been there! Run!! Start looking. But let them let you go if.... Unemployment!! Do not quit until you find what you want. Been there 3 times
Annetta MosesSeptember 13,2022 at 6:49AM UTC
Based on your recap of the situation, I suggest you update your resume and start looking for another position. Your current manager is not supportive and HR seems to align with your manager.
For future reference, if your manager comments on your performance, you want to correct your error and document via email your correction and acceptance of the correction.
Basically, if a manager wants you out, it is a matter of time before you are terminated.
Good luck.
AnonymousSeptember 13,2022 at 12:26PM UTC
It sounds like the manager is trying to manage you out of the company and is being backed by HR. I have to agree with the other posters that you should run, not walk from this company. I also wouldn't take it personally (even though it is personal). This manager, for whatever reason, is trying to get you to move on and if your performance review was positive, there was no notice about slipping and HR is still allowing a PIP then the message is clear. Sorry this is happening but it just means this is not the place for you. Good luck and I know you will find something better for you!
AnonymousSeptember 13,2022 at 12:26PM UTC
Time to move on. She wants to get rid of you and has found the 'legal' way to do it. You're not going to change her or make her suddenly like you. It seriously sucks but the writing is on the wall and it's time to think about you.
AnonymousSeptember 13,2022 at 12:33PM UTC
Your old boss was pushed out and it seems like you are next. HR wasn't there for your old boss so it seems they won't be interested in keeping you either.
AnonymousSeptember 13,2022 at 2:34PM UTC
No. Your manager wants you gone. Harsh, but true. No one gets put on a PIP unless they want you out. Don't even bother. Look for a new job.
SmileySeptember 13,2022 at 9:11PM UTC
I would ask manager and HR why she stopped your one on one and assigning you duties. If she had conve
SmileySeptember 13,2022 at 9:20PM UTC
I would ask manager and HR why she stopped your one on ones and stopped assigning you tasks. If she had numerous conversations with you about job performance concerns, you were aware although she may have not done in a formal setting. You can be placed on a PIP plan any time performance has failed. My recommendation is that you improve your performance if needed so it shows there are no concerns. Treat them with kindness as it wins everytime and make your next move if still unhappy with manager.
AnonymousSeptember 13,2022 at 11:52PM UTC
She told you what she felt you were doing wrong, you disagreed with her opinion and chose not to address those issues because you felt they were minor. Somewhere along the way she decided you weren't worth her time since you weren't taking direction from her. That was probably around the same time she started meeting with HR about how to deal with an employee who wouldn't listen to her. At the end of the day, she's the boss and you dismissed her because she wanted things done differently than your previous boss. I'm not entirely clear on what you felt she should have done differently.
JJSeptember 14,2022 at 2:33AM UTC
I’m sorry this is happening. You can ask but HR protects the company, not you. Seems like they want you out.
AnonymousSeptember 14,2022 at 4:29AM UTC
You are focused on somehow holding HR and your manager responsible for protocol. When the bottom line is that there is nothing you can do. Water under the bridge.
You either accept the PIP and do your damage control to try and keep your job while you find another or quit now. Trying to find process errors and explanations for the chain of events is not going to help you.
HR is not there to help you. HR is there to support your manager and protect the company. They have no role in helping you understand your situation. You have been put on a PIP. Trying to find a reasons other than minor mistakes is futile.
Unfortunately there is little you can do. Your manager does want you on her team.
AnonymousSeptember 14,2022 at 1:12PM UTC
Correct. It's best to start looking for a new job now to avoid having to explain a termination if you wait. Your boss wants you out.
AnonymousSeptember 14,2022 at 1:43PM UTC
I relate to this 100%.
It’s as if you are describing my former boss to perfection. It was the most shocking and frustrating situation to encounter. I highly suggest you document EVERY interaction with your mgr, no matter how tedious. I had a text conversation with mine about an issue, and I interpreted her responses that she was annoyed( it was her day off) and that she gave responses that to me said she was not understanding my issue and seemed bothered. Fast forward to a month down the road I get a completely unexpected written warning that contained exact fragments of that text. She manipulated them to imply she was adamantly directing me to do something particular when in fact she barely seemed interested in the entire conversation.
I really don’t know what to tell you otherwise. What I learned later was she was thrown into a management position because of covid that she was not qualified for. She took down anyone who could shine a poor light on her in ANY capacity. From the delivery guy to her co-lead in the department. Cover your behind completely. My advice would be don’t kick the hornets nest, take your punishment so to speak and plug along. I’d also think very hard about exploring other job opportunities for yourself. Her style is not direct. It’s behind the scenes , come at you out of left field, as was mine. People like that who have a hidden agenda are miserable to work for. I was able to find something so much better after a time, but not without all the emotions, second guessing, and sadness that came fro m leaving a job I loved prior to her arrival. Best of Luck. Focus on you!
AnonymousSeptember 14,2022 at 2:13PM UTC
Clearly your manager is either threatened by you or doesn't know how to manage. Start keeping copious notes, down load NOW all emails you have shared with her. Every in person/on the phone conversation you have with her, send a follow up email, and bcc yourself. Unless you love your department/company I would start looking for another job. Be sure not to gossip/talk with anyone other than HR about these problems.
AnonymousSeptember 14,2022 at 4:07PM UTC
Being an HR manager, if another manager says they can no longer work with an employee, whether it is due to attitude, performance, or insubordination, even if I do not agree, (which has happened before), we will have a discussion about next steps either way, to improve things or the other direction. If they can show me instances why this needs to happen, then we move ahead. Even in an at will state, I want concrete reasons why.
If it has gotten to the point of a PIP, then most likely they are managing you out. I have said this to others, (not at my company) before, unless you are 100% certain you can meet and excel at every point listed in the PIP by tomorrow, then you need to find a new job now. They are now looking to manage you out and show cause for termination. That does not mean to stop trying. Keep trying and do ask for more clarification; however, realize that if it is to the point of a PIP, this is the last step before termination. Your PIP may even have a due date or say immediately on it.
When I have disagreed with firing someone or putting them on a PIP, I have spoken up, but I have been overruled by someone higher up before. At that point, I usually make them show more proof of why this needs to happen. I am sorry it is happening to you. Good luck, ramp up your resume, contact staffing agencies, and start looking now.
AnonymousSeptember 15,2022 at 5:27PM UTC
Been there, done that.
I slept on the conversation regarding a PIP after being completely blindsided. I returned to work the next day and wrote up my resignation letter giving a two week notice and I believe it was the right thing to do.
I went to work every day during that two week period and prepared a manual for my successor to follow step-by-step each of the procedures of my duties. I sat down and went over it with my two leaders and they were blown away at how much I was and had been doing. They had no clue. They hired three people to replace me. None of them are there any longer and I miss the job, but it gave me such relief to go out on a positive note and for no one to be able to say I didn't do my job well.
This was a newer manager who was hired after my original boss left. He was very young and continued to push anyone older out for whatever reason. I had just had a great review and had been given five raises in less than two years, so it really wasn't about me - it was him.