I have a toxic boss and no one is doing anything about it.

70 Comments

1. AnonymousApril 20,2022 at 1:55PM UTC

   Be prepared to look for a new job. By passively communicating your lack of tolerance, you are passively communicating your willingness to leave. No ultimatum can professionally be tolerated. And speaking on behalf of everyone can easily backfire.

   I would rethink your communication.

2. AnonymousApril 20,2022 at 2:35PM UTC

   Thank u!
   Yes, I am looking for new opportunities and also strengthening my skills.

3. AngieApril 20,2022 at 4:19PM UTC

   Of course, HR is not going to do anything since the CEO seems to be tolerant of it. No further communication is needed on the issue at this point. Move in silence while looking for another job.

4. Barb HansenApril 20,2022 at 4:27PM UTC

   "hang in there" isn't great advice from the CEO.

   "hang in there" as in, "I know this manager is a problem, but I'm not going to do anything about his behavior" ?

   or

   "hang in there" as in, "I know this manager is a problem, and I'm working on fixing the problem" ?

   I don't think I would waste my energy trying to fix a man who's bad behavior is being supported by senior management. I would be looking for another job.

   But, if you wanted to try, here is a suggestion:

   Schedule a meeting with your manager.

   "Last week, we had a meeting with you where you listed a number of issues that the team and I weren't doing right, and you seemed upset during the meeting. To prevent this type of meeting from happening again, I want to discuss how you and I can find a better way to communicate with each other, as I have been working here for X # of years and until last week, I had no idea that I was not performing these tasks correctly. There is no need for anyone to be upset if we can resolve our communication issue. What's the best way for you to communicate best practices to me and the rest of the team? "

   And then I would be prepared for him to continue being a bad manager.

5. AnonymousApril 21,2022 at 10:53AM UTC

   Thank you!

   I think she meant "I know this manager is a problem, and I'm working on fixing the problem"

   We have weekly team meetings with this manager, I might try that suggestion.

   But still, I'm over it at this point, it's like a toxic relationship. I deserve better.

   Thank you ladies for your feedback!

6. AnonymousApril 22,2022 at 1:22PM UTC

   I am so sorry this is happening to you. Unfortunately, many of us have been in similar situations. I've also been told to "hang in there" and I shouldn't have listened. I should have listened to my instincts and left, but I stayed longer than I should have and suffered burnout. If put in that situation again, I would leave as quickly as possible. We always need to put our own health and well-being first. Good luck with your job search and on your new journey.

7. AnonymousApril 22,2022 at 11:14PM UTC

   Thank you so much

8. AnonymousApril 20,2022 at 6:41PM UTC

   Others have already delivered the message via job resignations. You don't need to tell them. Toxic management is obviously a feature and not a bug.

   Cut your losses and run.... ASAP!

9. AssistantApril 21,2022 at 2:19PM UTC

   You don’t need to be the one to tell him anything. Just exit. You don’t need the stress and the satisfaction of telling him all the negative stuff would just be a fleeting moment. Just find another job asap.

10. Erin BeemerApril 22,2022 at 12:16PM UTC

    It's not your responsibility to stay and try to fix him or the situation... but with that said, I wish that women in general would stand up and push out these bad managers instead of moving on while they continue bad behaviors or worse - get promoted. If you like the company, your role, your colleagues, etc... why should you have to give it up? If this kind of behavior is the norm and not the exception at your company though, I'd move on. Sorry you're dealing with it... I've been there and just adds so much unnecessary stress.

11. AnonymousApril 22,2022 at 1:16PM UTC

    I find it interesting that someone can rise to CEO and not be able to get rid of somebody who poisons culture at their organization. My CEO is the same way...it takes 2 years before he pulls the plug on toxic personalities. Dude, do the deed and help them find opportunities elsewhere. That's why you get paid the big bucks. How many good people have to leave??

12. AnonymousApril 22,2022 at 1:31PM UTC

    Document everything regarding his destructive behavior while looking for another job. Companies usually tolerate and even enable this type of personality when they believe they are bringing value to the company so if you do have the opportunity to give feedback on him again give dispassionate and factual information on how his management style and skills are affecting company performance. Even a tone deaf CEO can’t ignore that. He may have described the other employees that quit as being part of his plan to improve the department. He may also be under HR investigation or PIP hence the CEO comment so only you can decide if you’re able to stick this out if that is the case. In the meantime - document, document, document.

13. Vanda LeeApril 22,2022 at 3:08PM UTC

    Unfortunately, I wouldn't expect any quick changes. I was under a manager who ran 10 good people off in 7 years. I was the 8th a year ago and there's been 2 more. This was a wonderful well known global company that unfortunately allowed this manager to continue his poor leadership. I went to HR who did investigate but came back with "while the incidents are alarming, we found no violations in policy" so basically he didn't break the law but was just a shitty manager. There was a re-org and I was fortunate to retire out with a decent severance. My advice is to prepare to leave. If they don't see it by now and the CEO won't take action, they just don't have what it takes to address it. They are blind and are ok with losing good people vs addressing the real issue. You can't fix this so don't waste your time. Take care of yourself... I will never struggle thru doing what I thought was the "right" thing ever again in my career... it didn't work and my health and wellbeing suffered immensely.

14. AnonymousApril 22,2022 at 8:08PM UTC

    I dealt with a toxic woman for two years and then had to lead a large team with her. It was a nightmare. If your leadership team is unwilling to insure that toxic behavior is unacceptable, you should walk away. I know it can be scary but there are SO MANY organizations out there, where you don’t have to deal with that type of culture.

    Im sorry you’re going through that. I know it can feel like your only options would be to stay and complain or stay and tolerate but you can also leave.

    You deserve better

15. AnonymousApril 22,2022 at 11:11PM UTC

    Thank you, you’re right!

16. AnonymousApril 23,2022 at 12:22PM UTC

    Unless I missed something, you haven't mentioned any attempt to look for another job.

    You do not have to stay. Why are you even trying to resolve this? It never will be.

    Document, document, document every single incident. It's a bit of work but do it.

17. LisaApril 23,2022 at 12:24PM UTC

    "nobody is doing anything about it"

    You are the one that needs to do something. And that's something is to leave immediately.

    You are relying on other people whose jobs would be on the line. They are not going to help.

    Help yourself.

18. AnonymousApril 23,2022 at 12:24PM UTC

    Time to vote with your feet! Obviously management knows and is not doing anything about it!

19. AnonymousApril 23,2022 at 12:28PM UTC

    I was not in a large company, but in a really small firm that had only four people. My boss was very toxic. While initially very excited about the position, on day two, when I left for the day I thought “what have I gotten myself into.” I would often cry on the way home. On week 4, I gave my notice and left at the end of that week. I decided my mental health was more important than that job. I am now in a position I absolutely love!!! Take care of yourself first, especially if nothing is being done about him! Look for something else. You leaving is not your loss, it is a loss for the company.

    (I found out that others had left the firm I was with, sometimes going to lunch and just not coming back. That says a lot.)

    Good luck!!!

20. Maria Paula CalvoApril 23,2022 at 12:28PM UTC

    I am not sure what kind of company you work at but in my experience I have seen many times that these type of attitudes or conducts are treated softly if the persons that generate them are considered to be contributing in a large manner to company´s financial results. And since these topics are mostly based on perceptions they are too subjective so as to have strong tangible proof of them happening. I may recommend that you find out and use the "whistleblowing" mechanisms available at your firm to force for a specific consideration of the matter. I have witnessed cases where from a subsidiary the affected person made an anonymous report to the global hot line and trust me the case was made a priority and got enormous and exemplary visibility. Hope this helps!

21. Ladyboss501027April 23,2022 at 12:30PM UTC

    Look for another job and be frank about the situation. I would literally say “have you considered there may be some behaviors that are alienating the team? We’ve lost a lot of talent lately”

22. AnonymousApril 23,2022 at 12:32PM UTC

    Unfortunately, this is common. I have been in a similar situation for several years now, and have made the decision just in the last week to look for a new job. It's always disappointing to have a boss who does not treat you well. But, at the end of the day, you have to get yourself out of the situation. I have gone to HR in previous situations, but in my experience, it has been no help - and more than once, my boss was informed of the conversation with HR. HR is there to protect the company, not the employees, which is also unfortunate.

23. KelleyApril 23,2022 at 12:51PM UTC

    I went through something very similar where those above my boss were sympathetic but did nothing. I went to HR as well and they just suggested ways to work with my boss and speak to her about her actions. This didn’t work either. At the end of it all, our whole team quite one by one and went on to better jobs. I hate to say it but if it’s not working out despite your efforts, and it’s affecting your mental health, it may be time to look elsewhere for work.

24. AnonymousApril 23,2022 at 12:58PM UTC

    I just left a very toxic environment-stayed for 2 years and there were “calm” moments, but there’s definitely a cycle and a pattern that I started to notice.
    I worked directly for the 2 partners - one super toxic and the other enabled the behavior. I agree, at the end of the day, it’s important to remind yourself there are companies, employers, and coworkers that do not behave in such toxic ways-and to stay is only prolonging the inevitable, but more importantly it 100% will affect all aspects of your life and mental health… it’s just not worth it… I had an interview and a follow up conversation with an employer that was refreshingly positive-the vibe was very different.

25. AnonymousApril 23,2022 at 12:59PM UTC

    Leave that company as soon as you can because the situation will not get any better.

26. Susan PickmanApril 23,2022 at 1:01PM UTC

    Start looking for a new job. A toxic boss is bad for your health and career. If the company is not willing to get him an executive coach, because they want to keep him for some reason but he needs work then you need to go. Do not say that you are going to quit, but that should be apparent after your conversation with the CEO and his lack of responsiveness. Just make plans to move on!

27. Kyle ClaassenApril 23,2022 at 1:14PM UTC

    I'd say look for a new job, but this is just personal thought. My mother was in the some situation 1 yea, ago, she leftand found another job and she loves her current job. But if you and your manager have bad blood, doesn't the manager at the job you are applying for need to talk to your previous manager to get an understanding of what kind of worker you are? And if you and your manager have bad blood that manager won't have anything nice to say? Isn't that correct? So how would you find a new job?

28. AnonymousApril 25,2022 at 3:42AM UTC

    You can absolutely let the new company know that you are not comfortable with them talking to CURRENT manager-She can give references from past employers.

29. Kyle ClaassenApril 25,2022 at 12:59PM UTC

    Right, thanks.

30. AnonymousApril 23,2022 at 1:19PM UTC

    "It was obvious that the CEO spoke to him".

    Hmmmm. "and he was just taking it out on us". Hmmmm. and, "this boss had 4 people under him quit last year". Hmmmmm again. So....this resonates so loudly with me.... I've had this happen. Yes, indeed...and I thought being "honest" with leadership would help, but it did not. Leadership simply deflected my comments/concerns back to the manager, who then targeted me for a year before I was terminated "without cause"- There's so much to say about your situation but girlfriend....getting bad vibes here. I see a trainwreck coming for you. If you want to stay employed, ride under the radar and keep looking for another job. The company does NOT care. You stated yourself that 4 good employees left last year--and if your employer isn't taking THAT seriously, then they don't care at all. You see, employee turnover is costly and esp in this era. OH...you want to talk with HR??--- Don't bother. In my former workspace, I went to HR---very naively---had an hour meeting with one of the HR managers. She was very sympathetic (she knows me outside work and can vouch for my character)--HR was powerless to do anything at all. They are there to represent the company and at the end of the day, they work with rags in their mouths--HR can say or do nothing for you. They will simply report what you said to them!!!-- Listen--I wish so badly that someone had told me all of this "before" I opened my mouth to the company president (who I "thought" would care about serious issues, but he just baled out)--Had I known what i know now...I would have kept my mouth shut and found another job. That's what You need to do. No more "talking to people" or "expressing how you can no longer tolerate him". They won't want you anymore. Keep us posted!

31. AnonymousApril 23,2022 at 1:26PM UTC

    I agree with the posters below, but don’t expect HR or other Management to help. It’s a “club”, and you’re not in it. Look for a new job. I was in your situation, earlier this year, raised the toxicity and retaliation to HR, Ethics, and senior management as they all posted that they wanted to know about such things and that it was our responsibilities as employees to tell them. Result: after 35 years of glowing appraisals I was summarily fired. Fortunately I had already filed an EEOC case, so now it is clear what they did. Cover yourself: if you must file a complaint, file one OUTSIDE of your company. Do not, I repeat DO NOT, trust HR. Ever.1

32. Joanna PoeApril 23,2022 at 1:31PM UTC

    It sounds like he's just a horrible boss but probably hasn't done anything actionable, so this is a tricky place for HR. They honestly don't exist to make people have better relationships at work. Until they see it as a problem with attrition that's losing the company money and time, they won't step in to do anything.

    Find something new, and then ask for an exit interview where you explain your reasons. The "I'm going to quit soon" conversation won't help anything and could blow up in your face.

33. AnonymousApril 23,2022 at 1:58PM UTC

    This is the statement. HR does not exist to improve your relationships at work. I am not an HR worker but this lesson has been made clear to me over the course of my career. Stating that your boss doesn’t like you because he’s doing and saying things that make you feel bad but don’t violate company policy is just plain complaining to them. They don’t care that you feel bad because there are so many, many workers who say that just because they don’t want to work hard. It’s too difficult (and costly)to weed out the liars. This is unfair when the situation is valid, but it’s the truth. HR are not school yard mediators or therapists. Going to them and saying you’re going to quit because of your boss is more closely related to threatening them than it is to giving them fair warning. Fair warning is provided with your actual resignation. And at that point, the boss is no longer your problem.

34. StellaApril 23,2022 at 1:33PM UTC

    It is time to find another job sorry to say. I had the same thing happen to me. Went to my managers they had a discussion with my boss and there became hidden retaliation against me by my boss. I then received an extremely negative review, which I had never received in my entire career, I was then put in a PIP. During my meeting with HR it became clear that my treatment was not going to be given any consideration. I had to leave I’m not going to work in a bully school yard. If you take pride in your career and your accomplishments go where you are valued and leave the cheap seats to others.

35. AnonymousApril 23,2022 at 4:09PM UTC

    I’d like to be able to say that Stella’s situation was just an exception, but sadly it seems to be all too common.
    Other than the PIP, I also experienced what she did. Mine ended with a retaliatory termination, but it all depends on how much time and money your company’s legal team is willing to waste. Their hope is that you’ll go away quietly.

36. AnonymousApril 23,2022 at 1:39PM UTC

    I reported my toxic boss' actions at my exit interview - I was forced out by this toxic boss - and HR told me this "wasn't the time or place" to discuss this(!!) The good news is that one thing I reported did get noticed, that my boss had violated a specific company policy. I'm not sure if my toxic boss got written up for that though. A year later they left but got a much better job in a different city.

37. Wole IkotunApril 23,2022 at 1:58PM UTC

    I would say look for another job, from experience, people like that never change, at your exit interview you can tell HR your reasons for leaving.

    I once worked for a company where the new boss was just completely anal, and in the course of having weekly one on ones with the team would upset people to the point of wanting to quit.

    When it was my turn to meet with him, I told him, the team would be best served if he adopted a different approach, but Ofcourse he did not listen and continued throwing his weight around.

    It was not surprising to me the following week when the VP showed up in the office to fire him face to face.

38. GirlBossanova934974April 23,2022 at 2:01PM UTC

    It is clear that the CEO is a paid manager with no much skin in the game aka little or no ownership of the company. Owners usually take action when so many people leave. You can either transfer to another group or leave the company.

39. AnonymousApril 23,2022 at 2:09PM UTC

    Don't bother with HR, just find a new job and leave.

    And don't bother with the exit interview. Like multiple posters said, HR is NOT there to protect the employees, it's there to protect the company.
    I had a toxic boss even worse than that. Or entire team quit or got fired by him except me and one other lady in 2020 and NO ONE NOTICED! He then started coming after me and the other lady and I was able to jump ship. Given his previous behavior I made sure "not to poke the bear", since we would've been happy to try to ruin my entire career and even tried to sue one of the people he fired.
    But a third lady was hired in a leadership role in the meantime. She ended up quitting over him, reported EVERYTHING to HR and currently he still works there.
    So be wise and don't start a war you won't win, just get a new job and move on, and try to watch out for red flags so you don't "jump from the frying pan into the fire"

40. LadyBoss201April 23,2022 at 2:12PM UTC

    Run!
    Toxic bosses don’t leave or get better! Trying to do the right thing only makes it worse. I’ve been there.

41. AnonymousApril 23,2022 at 4:52PM UTC

    Agree! Been there and done that too! Unfortunately, in my situation HR was just as toxic as my manager … so ,it was definitely a company culture issue beyond the person. Run, run, run!

42. AnonymousApril 23,2022 at 2:33PM UTC

    Don't be shy, name that company! But seriously, I hope we can start to avoid organizations that support abusive systems. The days of managers with low EQ - - (inability to self reflect, empathize deeply, actively listen,& empower employees instead of insecurity/ego-driven dictatorial management, etc) - - are over. Hopefully.

    I'd just tell HR that enabling that kind of behavior from anyone, without any protections in place from his retaliatory measures and protection of employee psychological safety, is no longer a safe nor tolerable environment.

43. AnonymousApril 23,2022 at 3:01PM UTC

    It’s unfortunate, but workers are expected to adapt to fit their managers and if there is a clash, management usually assumes the worker has a bad attitude.
    I would not go to HR. Telling them you might quit sounds like a threat and makes them think of you as disloyal. The best thing you can do is start the process of looking for a new job. I was ready to leave my job last year and I initiated a job search. They were afraid I might leave and gave me a raise and made a few other changes. I never even went on a single interview!

44. Christi MillerApril 23,2022 at 3:11PM UTC

    Look for a new job. HR will stick with the manager. Manager bad behavior is often tolerated especially if they are seen as delivering results. Managers are typically very good at managing upwards and may not be good at actually managing teams.

45. AnonymousApril 23,2022 at 4:17PM UTC

    I had a toxic boss, too.

    He was the owner of the firm. He would constantly come down to my office and berate me and try to humiliate me in front of other people. Finally, he came in one day and made a nasty comment and then expressed how he did not like my reactions whenever he approached me about something. He then started to walk out of my office. When he got to the door, I said, "Well what do you expect when you come down here all the time and beat me up the way you do?" He turned around and his head was spinning like Linda Blair's in the Excorcist. He told me he wanted to see me in his office right now. To which I said, "Absolutely. Let's do it." So we went down to his office and shut the door. He started to give me a rash of sh** and I stopped him. Told him I do not talk to him or any of my co-workers the way he speaks to me and, therefore, I did not expect him to speak to me that way, especially in front of my co-workers. His response was that whenever he wants to speak to me that way that he will just ask me to come down to his office. I told him I did not think he understood me clearly. I expressed that he does not get to talk me that way either in front of my co-workers or in private. It does not matter. You don't get to speak to me that way ... period. He did not like it but he understood my position. He continued but less frequently. I eventually left over a COVID dispute, which I will share with everyone later. Toxic bosses are not worth it. This guy's turnover was atrocious. Any wonder why?

46. AnonymousApril 23,2022 at 5:34PM UTC

    I'm in a similar situation. Get out now.

47. AnonymousApril 23,2022 at 6:11PM UTC

    Just left my position for similar reasons.
    My boss did so many egregious things he should have been fired, but no, when they came to light he got promoted up the chain. When a company has invested that much in a director/admin they don't want to lose them so often sweep their bad behavior under the rug.

    Document everything. Every inappropriate interaction, every breach of civility, etc. You can take it up the chain but very likely nothing will happen. Seen it too many times, unfortunately.

48. AnonymousApril 23,2022 at 6:17PM UTC

    What exactly do you think you can do about it?

49. Christine Brush, MSW, MBAApril 23,2022 at 6:37PM UTC

    Everyone needs to tattoo this on the inside of their eyelids: bosses love bullies. The bully is beloved of management because they do Management's dirty work for them, and bullies love doing it. The bully is a master of social engineering who knows how to always be in Management's good graces - always appearing smooth, polished, professional while getting you to behave like an unprofessional, emotional mess. The bully has honed his social skills with the upper management like a rapier, and unless you have their level of skills the bully is going to get you to behave in a way that makes you look bad to your executives. At this point by complaining to Management you already lost; the bully will have a smooth polished response to your accusations and management will defend the bully to the death because they are the model employee and guard dog while you are now a whiny trouble making employee. Move on, and take time to learn everything you can about workplace bullying and how bullies operate. Learn their methods and learn to let their words and actions roll off your back while you set up your own social skills and get in with the managers. You are not actually there to work - you are there to play an ego game and a social game. Focus on learning how to do this so you never fall into this situation again.

50. AnonymousApril 25,2022 at 1:22AM UTC

    Exactly.

    Spot on. Been there. My former boss was a bully but I knew she was also following the orders of the chief bully. She was the Queen of Office Machiavellianism. I eventually left because I knew my skills and experience were not valued. Either I shut up and accept the bullying-- because upper management did not want to intervene and made it clear-- or move on. And not long after, found out that the chief bully moved on to a lower-paying job. The Queen was in the good graces of upper management and probably tossed him under the bus after one too many staffers went after her.

51. KileyApril 25,2022 at 8:19AM UTC

    Ego game and social game. Spot on!

52. louwhoApril 23,2022 at 6:48PM UTC

    It’s a tough situation. I just left a position recently because of a toxic boss. When I submitted my resignation I kept it professional stating I had accepted another opportunity. In the exit interview I documented my true reasons. Sadly this happens a lot and depending on the company culture it may not be addressed if the higher ups don’t address.

53. AnonymousApril 23,2022 at 7:09PM UTC

    I, too, work for an extremely toxic boss - but her negativity and toxicity are aimed solely at me and my team. I know this sounds cliche’, but several others have noticed it, too. I called her on it at one time - said it felt like there was something about me that was frustrating to her, and if she’d be honest with me, I was happy to address the issue and work to make it a better situation for both of us. She informed me that several employees had addressed to her that they thought she didn’t like them, but “I don’t have time to worry if people think I like them or not. I have a job to do.” Then, in a staff meeting she preaches about how important it is to make your people feel valued. I wanted to throw up. Working for her has been detrimental to my health…stress level thru the roof. My hair started falling out. I’ve been looking for another job. It’s hard, though, because I love the team I’ve assembled, and they’re doing great work. I try not to put so much energy into her actions towards me, but it’s hard. Oh - and - she’s at the top of the HR food chain, so “going to HR” is out of the question. ?

    I welcome any and all suggestions. I’ve been in this position for a year, and it’s been the worst year of my 35 year professional life - hands down.

54. ReachingGoalsApril 23,2022 at 8:07PM UTC

    Sorry to say, like everyone else, you need to leave. I've worked for toxic boss. Owner of company and there were usually only 2-3 of us in the office. Got tired of being beaten up and told I wasn't "doing enough". It was just like an abusive marriage and when I walked away that last day, my family told me the change in my face that night was dramatic. She even had the nerve to throw me a "good luck" lunch and had her adult children come "because we were all like family". Her daughter asked where I was going because I hadn't told anyone.

    My Answer: I don't have a job lined up. I'm just done here.

    Shockingly she didn't follow the rules of references, and gave me a horrible one instead of yes she worked here. Fortunately my next employer saw through her. He told me a few years later, said her comments were so off what all my othr references said, that he knew that something was wrong and was impressed that I hadn't said anything about working with her other than it was time to move to something else.

    Keep your head high.

55. Anne M GinsbergApril 23,2022 at 9:50PM UTC

    Just get out. HR is there to protect the company and will do nothing for you; don’t waste your time there. Find another job and get out.

56. AnonymousApril 25,2022 at 1:03PM UTC

    Understand that HR is also an employee of the company. There is no secret HR handshake that happens that says, "my HR duties solely support the organization".

    There are so many posts on this site regarding toxic environments, toxic people, poor management, toxic boss, undermining co-workers, etc. HR does not exist to support and defend poor behavior. HR certainly does not want or need any more issues to deal with. (Someone is peeing on the floor in the men's bathroom; deliveries are being dropped by the bottom of the stairway; even though the deliveries are not for us, they belong to other organizations in the building; do something about retention; start the performance review process with corporate approval for maximum 1.5% increase; where are the immigration numbers; how long is it taking to process I9s). Trust me.........HR is not supporting horrible behavior. Most times they are dealing with it like everyone else - along with getting everyone paid on time, administering benefits/benefit changes, recruiting, keeping a pulse on COVID regulations, responding to unemployment, conducting a PIP interview/review. etc.

57. AnonymousApril 25,2022 at 1:22PM UTC

    I'm not in HR but have worked closely with HR admins in the past. I agree wholeheartedly, all HR admins I've known were doing the job of several people. In addition, terminating someone isn't as simple as receiving some complaints, nor should it be. Termination reasons should be documented and defendable in the event of a lawsuit.

    That said, there should be people resources that can help employees navigate these situations successfully. In my company we had defined advocates that would advise, initiate discussions with the right people, and make sure employees got the support they needed without burning bridges unnecessarily. They worked with HR but were not HR admins themselves. I went through a pretty rough workplace bullying situation and they were able to negotiate a transfer to a different team where I did well. As for the bully, she had been on a path to leadership, and that path was stopped cold.

    I don't know how common these advocate roles are in small to medium companies, but if OP's company is on the larger side or very culture-focused there may be a resource that can help.

58. Anne M GinsbergApril 26,2022 at 8:29PM UTC

    They may not be supporting horrible behavior, but they’re certainly not doing much about it, especially if the horrible person generates revenue and the complainant does not.

59. AnonymousApril 24,2022 at 12:04AM UTC

    Hi! I can relate. All direct reports of my boss had FGD(Focus Group Discussion) with HR and we raised the issues of her behaviour towards us. The CFO was also made aware. Our hunch is that HR and the CFO already talked to her. Instead of trying to change her ways, this boss has started to rant that there are complaints against her. Obviously, trying to figure out who those people are. According to HR, retaliation is a terminable offence. My teammates and I were advised to observe her treatment. Next action step is to monitor and then raise it again to HR if it becomes a retaliation or if there is no change in her behaviour after all. lol. So if you truly enjoy being in this company, make all the necessary steps. Toxic culture is not good for your health so find a better job.

60. JD MagickApril 24,2022 at 12:34AM UTC

    Back in January I left a toxic job behind.
    I was initially hired to do PT HR work, however, when a discussion came up to that in structured me to use discriminatory actions in screening; I soon found myself on the receiving end of the verbal abuse I had heard about.

    They had me going things that I was physically stressed to do, including painting which aggravated my asthma.

    It was not my only job, and after nine weeks I left. Turns out I was eligible for unemployment too. There was a hearing with a judge who ruled in my favor.

    The problem is that I have documented injuries that are permanent. The former boss claimed they knew nothing about it (though I often walk with a cane). My current boss just laughed and says "I got you - file it."

    I'm still working for him (9 years now) and he is very understanding of my situation and physical limitations.

    Fighting a losing battle is not worth the mental strain and stress. I'm too old to play games and smart enough to pick my battles.

    Know your worth and remember that what you allow teaches people how to treat you. You can be firm and polite. If they can't, cut your losses. There's a lot of good people out there to work for.

61. AnonymousApril 24,2022 at 7:34AM UTC

    Honestly I wish I could say something positive.
    I went through this. My suggestion, find another job ASAP. I did the same thing you did, I went to HR and somehow I became the bad one for doing that and not keeping my mouth shut. It’s best to move on you will be happier.

62. Juanita JamesApril 24,2022 at 1:03PM UTC

    I'm sorry you have to go this but I've been and currently in the same position as you. I agree with everyone here and start doing what I'm doing--transfer to a new department and look for another job. Nothing is worth your piece of mind and spirit.

63. AnonymousApril 24,2022 at 10:13PM UTC

    I wouldn’t bad mouth him. You’ve already hinted about it to the CEO, who called you in about it and seemed sympathetic. Unless she’s trying to document a pattern of behavior to fire him, then there’s no reason for the CEO to bother asking you. I would find another job and if HR asks you, say that the CEO is already aware of all relevant reasons.

64. AnonymousApril 25,2022 at 1:34AM UTC

    It's so telling how many of us here advise the OP to get out. It doesn't matter how talented you are nor how well you are liked by your colleagues, even by upper management. The bad bosses will keep their jobs. You, the good employee, will have to find a new job. Maybe one day companies will wake up. Until then, I offer the same advice-- update your resume and find a new job.

    I went through something similar. My bully supervisor was recruited by upper management and they were not exactly going to fire someone they had handpicked for a management role.

65. Bradford McCormickApril 25,2022 at 7:15AM UTC

    You are one brave lady! Giordano Bruno was one brave scientist and he was burned alive at the stake.

    Your company should promote you for promoting your company's best interests, right? But virtue is often its own and its only reward, right? Do you have a Plan-B ready? Do you know how you are going to make your mortgage payments until you pay it off?

    If you can afford your virtue, you are highly to be commended. If not, respectfully, you may be sorry. Many decent persons would keep their mouth shut, do their job to their very best (not because the company deserved it!) and be getting their rear end out of the pace to some place better ASAP, but, of course, looking before they leap, too.

66. GillApril 25,2022 at 8:15AM UTC

    Oh dear. So I went through this exact same thing and stuck it out for over a year, but wound up having to quit. To say that I am appreciated in my new setting compared to the old is an understatement.

    My old CEO was averse to any sort of confrontation and because of that the bully kept getting away with it. I went all the way to the chairman as it was misogyny pure and simple but they didn’t know how to deal with it. So I left. Couldn’t do anything else in the end. Sorry for the ramble, what I am trying to say is recognise your worth before it gets too far. Don’t leave until the right opportunity comes along but also, keep an eye out and talk to contacts.

67. AnonymousApril 25,2022 at 8:16PM UTC

    The head of my old section was also averse to confrontation and because of that our bully was emboldened. I used to secretly call the head of our section "the turtle" because his office was more or less a shell he'd hide in, only to poke his head out once in a while when he absolutely had to. He never took charge and dealt with the situation. Instead, he got pushed out and the bully continues to thrive there to this day.

68. AnonymousApril 25,2022 at 1:29PM UTC

    Does your company have employee advocates? In my company we have a group of people who are here to help people navigate through these situations without burning bridges. A while back I was dealing with a workplace bullying situation with someone who was being considered for a management role that I would report up to. This advocate helped me transfer to another team where I've done well and have grown, while the bully's career is in what seems to be a permanent stall.

    If not, is it possible to transfer to a different team with better dynamics? Especially if you are generally happy with the company and the issue is just this one person. Either way, even if the CEO and HR are aware of this person's issues, getting rid of them is not a straightforward process and the resolution you want may take time, if you get it at all. You may need to decide if this is the hill you want to die on, or if it's time for a change.

69. AnonymousApril 25,2022 at 2:06PM UTC

    An employee advocate sounds like a wonderful resource. I have yet to hear of a place that has such a position on staff. Can you tell us more about this? I wonder if this is a relatively new offering for most companies-- I'm assuming you work for a large company that understands the importance of retaining good talent. As we all know here, at most companies, you're pretty much stuck with HR who 9 times out of 10 will side with the bully manager so the chances of negotiating for a transfer are slim to none.

70. AnonymousJuly 13,2022 at 1:12PM UTC

    You're right, most HR departments are there to protect the company.
    I would even say this applies to all HR departments, although some seem to take a more proactive approach (preventing problems from existing or escalating in the first place) rather than reactive.

    My company recently went through a merger and I'm not sure of the people advocate position is still a thing here. If not, it's a sad outcome of the merger, as the advocates were key in resolving problems in a way that minimized the loss of great people.