Frustrating call with a boss that refuses to be accountable for her actions

Anonymous

January 26,2023 at 9:40PM UTC

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Frustrating call with a boss that refuses to be accountable for her actions

I have worked for my current boss for a little over 5 months. After a lot of thought, I have opted to stay because the company is good, the team is good, I like what I do and who I support, the benefits are amazing and I am staring down retirement in 12 years so pension and amazing bonuses, and it is my first senior director position in an industry that I have been in 25 years (took so long because I only recently found confidence to challenge myself beyond my comfort zone).

My boss gaslights, makes excuses, patronizes, publicly shames and sometimes yells. Discussion today was over her absolute absence of support for months while I am following up via email, text message, putting time on calendar. She obstructs and impedes the business and then had the gall to say that I need to turn things around faster (when I am waiting on her approval) and then also said that weekly followups spanning months, phone messages, tagging her in a contract for review so she would be alerted, text messages as reminders and bringing it up during the one on one's that she didn't cancel - none of that was the right way to go about getting her to complete her part of the review. I specifically said that I did everything I knew how to do to follow up and she said, "No, no I don't think you did".

I mean, when I told her that I wasn't the only person that struggled with onboarding and we need to streamline and structure it and I am happy to help do that (read: there was no training and no direction), she said she wasn't aware if anyone else struggling with their first month. "It's not normal for people to have meltdowns during onboarding. " She replied laughing "And well, they are all thriving now!" I told her that doesn't correlate; training doesn't have to be traumatic.

Needless to say....I got frustrated after 45 minutes of obvious deflection and nonsense and it got to the point that I was struggling to not cry and then my voice broke. I didn't cry but you could tell I was holding back tears.

I have a strong, direct personality however I am also empathetic and can be sensitive depending on the subject. My job is in the legal field and confrontation isn't foreign to me.

But some people just git a soft spot with their nondense.

How the heck do I not get frustrated to the point of crying? I was dealing with what I believe to be a narcissist.

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AnonymousJanuary 26,2023 at 10:23PM UTC
Don’t engage emotionally — put your boss and your job at arm’s length.
Document all timelines and be very pleasant, but don’t let your boss deflect. Use the “gray rock” technique: be brief, factual and non-reactive. Remember, this is a marathon, not a sprint.
In practice, this looks like the following:
You: The report was e-mailed to you for approval on the 20th, boss, with text reminders on the 22nd and 24th and a call on the 27th. It is now the 28th, would it be helpful for me to send the report again?
You: I’ve used e-mail, text messages, phone and one-on-one meetings to solicit your input on the review. Specifically, boss, what additional steps do you suggest be taken to help you finalize the review?
This forces your boss to make concrete suggestions.
In addition: might it help to number or date your reminder emails and texts? 1st Reminder, 2nd Reminder, 3rd Reminder OR March 1 Reminder, March 2 Reminder, March 3 Reminder? This might catch your boss’s attention or, at the least, allow you to make a game out of the situation. (Will the boss respond by the 5th Reminder, or will she post a personal best with Reminder 6?)
The calm, non-reactive, well-documented response can be used to respond to excuses, outbursts and public rebukes, too.
That said, your boss sounds maddening. Might she have attention deficit disorder? And how do other managers get her to focus and respond?
I agree with the suggestion that you seek an internal transfer to escape this manager. Be glad that you work remotely.
AnonymousJanuary 27,2023 at 3:52PM UTC
I’ve been in this type of situation several times with hellish bosses or direct reports and originally I also meticulously documented all the details. I’ve discovered that in all my cases, no matter what the facts are, or how outrageously wrong the other person was, it didn’t matter. Their sense of reality doesn’t put them in the wrong, and they find a way so it’s their true belief vs your words, documented or not. There’s no one who will back you, or in a position that will make any difference, even if they believe you and/or are experiencing the same thing. Either you make peace with this version of reality or you leave for your own sanity.
I’ve just left a company amid all these layoffs because of my boss. It’s unfortunate but my boss has been at the company for 20 years so she won’t be going anywhere.
AnonymousJanuary 27,2023 at 6:05PM UTC
You make a great point. The boss has an ingrained pathology and is highly unlikely to change.
But at least the documentation, even when the boss doesn’t change, can be supplied to HR if needed or serve to help OP keep her sanity and — if OP makes the numbered reminders into a game — her sense of humor.
I think that you were wise to walk away from your boss, and I think that your advice to make peace with the situation or to leave perfectly frames the two choices confronting OP.
AnonymousJanuary 28,2023 at 2:17PM UTC
Same. While for me the bank account is dry, my mental state is 180 and better for me and all those in my life. It has taken a little over a year to heal enough to even begin to think about interviewing for new opportunities. The break has also given me the fortitude to set a new level of boundaries , starting at day one with the interview process. My thoughts are with you.
AnonymousJanuary 29,2023 at 8:39PM UTC
I'm very glad you got away from an abusive situation. The only issue/question I have is, how do you explain why you left to interviewers and potential employers without getting blamed implicitly? Leaving is still quitting to them, even if the job was horrendous.
AnonymousJanuary 29,2023 at 10:46PM UTC
It’s been interesting. No one has really asked- some have in round about ways and I tell them I needed a sabbatical. That startup life, COVID, homeschooling 3 young ladies took its toll on me. I am find this is really common right now with high performing women. Sever have said “that’s awesome” - everyone needs a break. I would have a different spin depending on the person meet with.
Stephanie LekowskiFebruary 1,2023 at 10:28PM UTC
Thanks :-)
AnonymousJanuary 28,2023 at 6:41PM UTC
Taking notes and plan to use your great advice!
AnonymousFebruary 2,2023 at 11:18PM UTC
Thank you very much! Yes, I think that this would be effective on multiple levels as it is making it obvious that I am documenting. I really appreciate this feedback.
AnonymousJanuary 26,2023 at 10:25PM UTC
I should mention that this is a 100% remote position
AnonymousJanuary 27,2023 at 2:06PM UTC
Hi. I'm in the legal field too. Fully remote. I have a female boss who publicly shames employees via to all cc: emails and somewhat sets people up for failure with vague instructions, etc almost like she's hazing people. And then treats you like an idiot for asking questions. She's the senior partner/shareholding manager. She's not going anywhere. I survive by seeing her behavior for what is - being about her. I also try to put myself in her shoes and be empathetic. I let myself complain about it for a second to myself when she's awful and then I just keep it moving and do my best. It's just a different work obstacle that you have to work around. I like my job otherwise and have no plans to leave. Maybe see it as an emotional intelligence exercise opportunity? I don't know.
KatJanuary 26,2023 at 11:08PM UTC
Can you transfer to another position within the company after you've been in a job 6-12 months? Your boss sounds terrible. She lacks empathy & people skills amongst other things. I had a boss like that & I avoided dealing w/him as much as possible. But if you're committed to this place long term (I get that), you'll need to find a different job (and boss) that is a better fit for you.
AnonymousJanuary 27,2023 at 1:18PM UTC
Get out as soon as possible. It doesn't get better. I worked in a firm for years and all it takes is one boss who is given carte blanche to make life hell. There are only so many ways to remind someone, and the fact that they still lecture on managing time is ridiculous. You're worth more than living in and/or through a Devil Wears Prada situation (if you haven't read it, find the book) .
AnonymousJanuary 27,2023 at 5:40PM UTC
I think you know what you are embroiled in in dealing with her. Best is to just stay the course and document her behavior. Never bring your emotions to the office because they won't help you to progress. I would see if there are any outlets in HR or the companies EAP- employee assistance program to talk to someone about how to process the gaslighting you are dealing with. Additionally, as a Senior Director you should own the relationship and not be asking for permission at this point in your career. Get it done, ask for forgiveness and pull the plug at the end of the day and focus on your self! You got this!
AnonymousJanuary 27,2023 at 10:45PM UTC
Honestly I would start looking for other positions within the same company, if you like the company. But this boss is never gonna let you succeed or thrive in this position. So I guess what I’m trying to say is take your talents to another department.
AnonymousFebruary 2,2023 at 11:16PM UTC
Thank you and yes, spot on. I get on very well with the COO at the parent company - she and I just flow and things fall into place. I am keeping an eye out on openings in other departments at our company and the parent company - signed up for notifications. My boss will not change - she wouldn't do what she does if it hasn't worked for her to get to the position of head of our dept. Changing depts is exactly what I am thinking too.
GirlBossanova934974January 28,2023 at 1:24PM UTC
After several decades in the working world, I have come to the conclusion that one should never stick around for "Loser Bosses". The "Loser Boss" will always take you down with them. If layoffs ever come around, they are the first manager to volunteer to lay off their direct reports. They rarely accept any responsibility for their actions or complete lack of action. The best thing is to look for a company transfer and get out. I have seen many direct reports over the years do this exact same thing.
Kathy LeskiJanuary 28,2023 at 7:04PM UTC
I agree with others' comments to look for a similar role in another department. However, I would also document, keep communications from her. One other thing you may be able to do as you're remote- is record group meetings, especially if they are ones you would need to take notes for.
Was she a new hire, or did she come from another department within the company? Has she provided you a performance review? I know it's only been 5 months, but as it's Jan, I assume you'll be getting one soon? If she was in another department, and you knew someone there, you may want to ask how she was there. If there were issues there, then I would speak with HR (if you have one). If she's new, I would still consider speaking to HR as she's new enough to still be under scrutiny. The behavior you describe usually comes from those who are not good at their jobs. They'll take the credit for successes and blame their team for failures.
misskelleypJanuary 29,2023 at 7:43PM UTC
Most states do not allow recording someone without their consent. Therefore I would caution against doing that. Unless you state at the beginning of the meeting that you are going to record so that you can take notes later.
Kathy LeskiJanuary 30,2023 at 12:40AM UTC
Agreed, most virtual conf tools display a message to all on the line of the recording as well.
AnonymousJanuary 30,2023 at 3:47PM UTC
So, it follows....check out your state laws. New York allows recording without notification as long as all participants are physically located in New York State. You don't have to use the platform recording function -- use your phone.
AnonymousFebruary 2,2023 at 11:13PM UTC
The virtual meeting provider that we use makes both a verbal and written announcement on the screen when a meeting is being recorded. Honestly, I don't see myself doing that.
AnonymousFebruary 2,2023 at 11:10PM UTC
She is not a new hire, no. She actually built the team and honestly, she built a very good team. I am finding that we look out for each other given that getting support from her is hit and miss and often weeks later if at all. She's been with the company for 4 years. I did have a review, yes, and there were a lot of passive aggressive comments in the written review and also things that she did not cover verbally in the one on one covering performance assessment nor at any other point in time. I actually set up 30/60/90 day time points to stay on top of what she thinks are strengths and weaknesses. So to be surprised in the review was disappointing. Strangely, I received 2 "bravo" awards from business partners during my first 4 months - she got an email informing her and I also attached them to my self-assessment....she didn't acknowledge them at all.
IntentionGirl299847January 28,2023 at 8:13PM UTC
She is a f***ing sniper. Confront with facts, when she says I don't think so, ask her for examples. Keep a record of all emails and send with read receipts that show she has them and opened these. Make sure the team is doing the same thing. If one person bitches it is sour grapes. More than 2, there is a problem. Show the facts to her boss. Then get her fired. Toxic.
AnonymousFebruary 2,2023 at 11:12PM UTC
I really appreciate how direct and clear you are! Not wrong! Thank you
AnonymousJanuary 29,2023 at 4:03AM UTC
When dealing with a narcissistic person like your boss, get everything in writing, never show emotion around the person, and understand that if you continue to expose yourself to the person, you will be harmed. There is no "winning" with such a person, and no collaboration is possible because they must exercise power and control at all times. It is best to move on. Do not go to HR, especially if this person has been with the organization for a period of time. Narcissistic people live in an alternate reality, and if you are a target, it will not change.
AnonymousJanuary 29,2023 at 4:43AM UTC
There are ups and downs in many work environments. Learn to adjust, if the rest are good. If it affects you mentally or physically, look at other options.