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The entitled and overly ambitious "know it all" type

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The entitled and overly ambitious "know it all" type

In my last two manager positions I have run twice already in this type of person that I find very disruptive and difficult to deal with. Both times they interviewed very well and had good credentials. But, once hired, they start judging, talking a lot, giving advice loudly of how things should be changed and making the case that they are better than others and should be promoted. They go around and socialize a lot, network and create allies. They undermined me as their manager by constantly bringing up opinions to how things need to be changed and at the end delivering little, but creating so much noise and blaming others that it becomes difficult to manage them out. They bring down morale and are very disruptive, but in somewhat gaslighting, subtle ways. Is this a new trend? How to manage this behavior?

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  1. Anonymous

    Just fire them. List all the unprofessional behavior and wish them luck in their new endeavors.

  2. Tope Roberts

    How about giving out a warning before you embark on this route?

  3. Robin

    I don't have any advice but want to see the replies!

  4. Anonymous

    How do you manage this behavior? You’re their leader so step up and lead! Correct unsavory behaviors real time, in the moment they’re happening. Attach consequences to behaviors, coach, discipline so others on the team don’t become demoralized. You’ll start to have retention problems with you good employees as these people continue unchecked. If these two people don’t get in line, write them up and fire them.

    You have a very small window of opportunity to right this ship. Otherwise this will very quickly reflect poorly on your management capabilities. And expect these two people to come after you. Best wishes in your next steps.

  5. Anonymous

    Maybe they are right.

    Consider if improvements are possible.

  6. Rebecca Milliken

    Who is the boss? Don't allow people to undermine you. When they give advice tell them when they're the boss they can do it that way, but they aren't. Seriously, you will have to step up and nip this disruptive behavior in the bud. The others you manage may not be enjoying this person's antics either.

    Part of being a manager is setting firm guidelines. Let them know their behavior is not going to be tolerated. If they are not delivering much , as you say, have a meeting and tell them they better shape up.

  7. Anonymous

    I have one of these as well. Great at talking about all the great things they can do but little in the way of actual results. Recently they have been broadcasting this "recruitment of allies" approach if they don't agree with an instruction I've given them. They won't directly argue or say no but instead say "so and so said to do it this way." Needless to say "so and so" wasn't even involved up until this point.

    OP, nip this behavior in the bud. By not addressing you are enabling it. It's hard and that's likely why no one else has dealt with it because it sucks. I would recommend an approach I was given a long time ago which describes the situation, the behavior, and the impact that it has. Breaking it down factually in that way has really helped me over the years in structuring these conversations.

  8. Anonymous

    Maybe they are right and some processes can be improved. Have you tried talking about what processes could be improved and the game plan? Honestly, my manager is very out of touch on the processes and easy to criticize me on things which she can and needs to take action on.

  9. Erin Vega

    My thoughts exactly.

  10. Anonymous

    Have a conversation with them and have them actually articulate what they think needs to be changed, why and how and how? nine times out of ten they are all talk and no show. But I also find that being direct and assertive is how you best deal with these kinds of people. But you have to give them a chance to put their money where their mouth is before you start correcting their behavior. And when you do start correcting their behavior do it in the same way they started putting all that noise in the system.

  11. Barbara

    Good advice. Just be careful not to make an enemy. They love having an enemy

  12. Anonymous

    I agree but that's why I say give them a chance to put their money where their mouth is and document document, document. Whatever policies and rules they want to change. Show them how to put those requests in, where I work, we have a review board for these kinds of things, EE's can put request in and then the board's vote on those ideas. And then when and if they're ideas aren't chosen, then its public record and the board explains why their ideas wont or don't work or are not a good fit for the business needs. When you start correcting their behavior, do it out loud just like they out all the noise in the system and out in the open in front of people, they will rethink how they approach you and how they bring things that they don't like to light. If you're doing this, then it won't matter if you make an enemy of them because it will all be on record and out in the open. People will start to see that this person is not worth a dime. They will lose credibility and then it won't matter whether they consider you their enemy or not.

  13. Anonymous

    Yes, this is the new behavioral trend. This generation is collecting degrees but have little people skills. They are driven by titles and money but don't carry the skills to back it up. They are not building a resume, they are bullying their way to the top. The under 30 crowd are very good at advancing their careers by using social media, not by working hard and getting better at the job. They are fearless about stepping on toes and although they lack skills, they make it up in their sense of self importance. I know that I am generalizing but it seems like this is a true trend.

  14. Barbara

    Unfortunately it’s not new. My president is pushing 80 and has been this way her whole career. Very successful and an absolute nightmare!

  15. Anonymous

    I agree, not new, I have seen this behavior in people in their 40s and up.

  16. Barbara

    They prevail and bullies rule! But I know how to handle them and still maintain my integrity and take care of my colleagues. That’s the real work!

  17. Anonymous

    You absolutely are generalizing. Folks collecting degrees without people skills is absolutely not new, and the prejudice you're holding here against younger people will not serve you (or wherever you work) well in the long run.

  18. Anonymous

    Uhhhhhh, you need to delete this biased comment. This "trend" is not a trend and not just one generation... a lot of people do this. Not just 30 somethings or degree holding persons. Everyone that upvoted this needs to delete themselves from this group. This is a people problem, and no matter their age, no matter whether they have a degree or not. People who are insecure and/or who lead with their egos are the ones who do this "trend".

  19. Anonymous

    Sounds like the president of my company! And we can’t fire her ! This is not a new trend. These folks are all over the workplace and these days are highly successful in organizations. Especially if they are bullies. I don’t know why, I don’t like it but that seems to be the reality. It’s a real pain to have one working for you. Watch your back and see if you can manage her over to another team. Make her someone else’s problem. She’s probably already found a higher up that she wants to get in good with and get promoted. Assist with that and be done with her

  20. Anonymous

    I just experienced this first hand this summer and it’s heart breaking to deal with ungrateful and undermining staff who only focused on advancing their career.

    I have now learned to carefully hire people. During interviews, people who are too charming and too “smooth” are red flags. It’s good to have confidence and skills, but you don’t want people who are going to stab you in the back.

    Documentation is also key. Make sure you document most interactions with these folks.

    Make sure your contributions and efforts are visible to your managers and peers. Hard work is nothing if no one can see it. Your performance speaks value and will justify your stay.

    You can’t control others pool behavior, you can only control your own. Keep a professional distance with your staff. Be polite but no need to be too friendly. Stay calm and if possible, move those folks to a different team.

  21. Anonymous

    I think this kind of behavior is becoming more prevalent at the office in general. It probably stems from the cutthroat nature of today’s economy and the false notion that being successful always means being at the top and making the most money. Everyone wants to be the office favorite in hopes of keeping their job or advancing.

    I’ve experienced this kind of behavior from both a fellow colleague on my team and a manager I had. The colleague was a textbook overachiever who frequently stepped on toes and did everyone’s job for them to make it look like everyone else wasn’t doing their work. She worked overtime and weekends. She stole people’s ideas and used them as her own. She frequently went above our manager and sucked up to the VP and undermined not only her team but our manager. This worked for her because she got promoted twice in the year I was with that company and she had a lot of power.

    At another company, I had an overachiever manager. He was the one who I interviewed with and he was clear that he was looking for a high performer. When I joined the company I did just that but not in an obnoxious or competitive way. I was hired to help him with his endless workload and so I jumped in and got a lot of stuff done and did it well. The department VP noticed my hard work and complimented me and after that my manager made my life miserable and refused to let me work on meaningful projects. I was later let go by said manager. I think he saw me as the overachiever when I just thought that was what I was hired to do.

    Long story short, I’ve seen managers exhibit that kind of overarching, control freak, corporate climbing behavior. Not saying you’re doing that! My point is that this kind of behavior is starting to become common from all levels. It’s awful and one of the reasons why office life is becoming even more exhausting.

  22. Anonymous

    It really depends on the environment. I'd say with the economy and years of focus on social/digital brand, a lot of folks are pushing to get ahead and playing a very narcissistic game (especially if the leaders were like this or value being pleased).

    It's not new, but it's been coming. More people want to push for what they want AND be seen as powerful/well-received in the process.

    Observe it, play the game of survival at your current employer and if that game is not for you, get out. Document everything. Don't be gas lit. Seek clarity and put it on them. See what they do. Be/build the change you want--and it may mean a move so make sure you're getting what you need (benefits, salary, etc.).

    Trying to swim in between both lanes may be very tricky. You may need to pick a side.

    Good luck!

  23. Anonymous

    To an extent it's human nature i think. It's always easy to see the pain points when u r outside looking in (perspective of a new person). I always try to learn to work in the dysfunction prior to chiming up with ideas. Usually I'm not the oy one who's thought of that and there's a genuine reason it wasn't put into use, like how it will affect the workflow upstream or down, budgetary, regulatory compliance ce etc.

    I say give them an opportunity to shoot their shot and put forth a plan to present to u. Something that YOU KNOW the backstory of. Then after their "presentation" ask them the tough questions they had not considered.

    A lil humble pie should do the trick. Granted this exercise does NOT have to b done publicly of course! It may better help to settle them and allow them to focus.

    Lastly, ppl listen more open to ppl that thoroughly know the CURRENT process when it comes to pitching new ideas in my experience. A self-serving goal that only benefits u or ur dept doesn't necessarily benefit the org or big picture!

  24. Anonymous

    So true! Great ideas and insight. It is easy to preach, but not so easy to do.

  25. Anonymous

    That's hard! As is often said, "the loudest mouth in the bunch is often the weakest." Folks that tend to sprout off like this know that they don't know much and have nothing or very little of value to offer. So, they compensate by sitting back and offering their sage opinions. They're like a cancer in an organization and the only way to deal with them is to get ahead and stay ahead of them and put them in the most uncomfortable position - and that is being held accountable.

  26. GirlBossanova934974

    When I started my career back 39 years ago, I was working with people like this all the time. That lasted for a good ten years. The difference? These people KNEW what the heck they were doing while management was rather clueless at times. That being said, you really need to change your approach and start LEADING instead of some form of MANAGING which you are doing. Statements like "manage them out" is NOT leadership. Having a FLAWED interview process where you continue to see this happen to you is NOT leadership. Unfortunately in today's world, so called managers have been taught that "CULTURAL FIT" is the thing one should look for when hiring. WELL OF COURSE, THESE BAD APPLES KNOW THIS! So they are going to agree with everything you say during the interview. In fact, MANY of them cannot give you a straight answer to the simplest question. Their responses are loaded with corporate gibberish. So make sure you ask some questions where you test them on the ability to give you NON FORM answers. As for them running around telling everyone how much they can do things. You should set expectations from DAY ONE that anyone is free to speak out. Just bring it up during your one on ones so it can be vetted and discussed. THERE IS nothing wrong with people who disagree with you. It prevents the organization many times from doing really stupid stuff and going over the cliff.

  27. Anonymous

    People show their best selves during interviews so the assumption that the interview process is flawed is a shortsighted perspective. Leadership requires recognizing when a person is disrupting the group cohesion, culture and outcomes. Sometimes there can be a cultural change with that person other times they need to go.

  28. Anonymous

    You give some valuable insight, but please do not judge too quickly with opinions about the person's ability to lead vs manage.

  29. Ally Morgan

    Devil's Advocate: You sound very resistant to and defensive about new ideas being brought into your group. Maybe some of these ideas are worth considering? As a managed person myself, a boss who is unable to see my value and refuses to allow for my ideas to be heard is super demoralizing. Why hire people if you don't allow them to add their unique value?

  30. Anonymous

    Why play devils advocate and assume the OP is wrong? There’s a difference between a person not being open to new ideas vs saying a new hire - with limited knowledge of the current work place, is acting like a know it all.

  31. Anonymous

    A person with truly good ideas and quality work does not have to play the vote-off-the-island allies game. I’m guessing the OP would accept new ideas if they are good ones.

  32. Anonymous

    New employees should actually get to know the ropes before trying to reinvent the company. Somehow it never occurs to them that we've already thought of those things and maybe even tried them out and they didn't work. Just maybe we knew what we were doing before they came along with their brilliant insights.

  33. Anonymous

    OP: I may sound resistant, but I really am open. What makes it difficult is that there are ideas thrown around from these people left and right, but little concrete practical suggestions on how to implement. They are quick to disruptive meetings, they go around to other departments and leaders to talk, but there is a deviation between their great ideas and what they actually accomplish in practice. Not that they are underperformed employees, but they are also not overperforming.

  34. Anonymous

    omg, I've got one of those as my current manager (I'm in management too, below her, but don't answer to her, thank goodness!) Absolute nightmare and will not ever take on feedback from the overall manager, who is both her and my my line manager...)

    Going anon on this one, just in case she's on here!

  35. Anonymous

    Today we refer to such personalities as "right fighters" still just as annoying as know it all s . You can't change their personalities but you can change their job function and pay increases, giving someone like this a 0% annual raise they usually get the picture to move on.

  36. JoAnna Black

    Sounds like you don't have a way for employees to share feedback and suggestions and actually feel heard. If this employee is disruptive in meetings, you need to firmly point them to the correct avenue for feedback and tell them there is always room for improvement but the way they are going about it will not result in change

  37. Anonymous

    This sounds like a teaching moment for your team.

    If your team has time to stop and socialize with their coworkers, use that time effectively as a brainstorming meeting.

    Has anyone on your team done anything with Root Cause Analysis? If there is a problem that everyone seems to agree on, perhaps there is an issue. The key is to determine the problem. The "loud" person should also be asked to consider long term effects of their decisions. Quick decisions are often just band-aids that will lead to bigger problems down the line.

    Try to spin this into a positive and work as a team and really listen to everyone's input. People are happier when they know they are being heard.

    When you are not willing to listen or assume the others are wrong because it is a different way of thinking, you show your team a fixed mindset. Teams can not develop or grow with that mindset. Collaborating and working on issues together lead to a growth mindset. You may be surprised at some of the things your team has as input.

  38. Nancy Stein-Pizzo

    Oh my goodness!!! We just got rid of a manager that matched this description exactly. She was moved to another department so we would have no contact with her. I just found out she will be moved again to a higher department in which we will all need to work with her again. She obliterated the culture in this department and turned everyone against each other. I dread working with her again.

  39. Anonymous

    Wow... now that's interesting Why? Because the higher up this person goes, the more she will be exposed, and people are going to see her for who and what she really is. Just think about it...she's already been moved from one department to another. That's really not a good sign because it shows that it's not the org, not the people but it's her. IJS

  40. Anonymous

    I know what you mean. New employees should actually get to know the ropes before trying to reinvent the company. Somehow it never occurs to them that we've already thought of those things and maybe even tried them out and they didn't work. Just maybe we knew what we were doing before they came along with their brilliant insights.

  41. Anonymous

    I chose not to hire someone who interviewed well but I just had a sense that they would be the type of employee you just described. They had a slight know it all, mean girl attitude in the interview though very subtle. They confirmed my suspicions by emailing me after (as an external candidate), shocked that they didn't get the position and wanting to know why.

    During interviews I try to sniff out any hint of negativity, because I'm building a positive team. Good interview questions to ask: how they would deal with unpopular decisions, how they have handled conflict/disagreements/ not gotten along with a co-worker in the past, or how they would react if they disagreed with their supervisor. If their answers give any tone of not taking accountability for their actions, blaming others, etc. then I have my answer.

  42. Anonymous

    I have been on both sides of this. I have had direct reports who wanted to change things without understanding all the implications. In that case, education was key. I could explain it or I could task them with getting all the info that would lead them to where they needed to be. I might even ask for a presentation and have others contribute, so it became an exercise in how to think about change. Often, they were looking at the silo of their workflow without understanding the big picture. You really don't want to squelch positive contributions AND you don't want to spend all your time having to manage bad ideas away.

    But I have also been part of a team that became part of a new company as a result of an acquisition, and members of this team were repeatedly beat down for bringing up problems that surfaced from the integration and which needed to be addressed for the business to be successful. Highlighting these issues was considered to be "negative". These cost the company millions. AND the employees were demoralized, stopped caring, and lots of talent left.

    You need to take a hard look at your culture, your goals, and how to motivate the team. You want them trying to improve the business and feeling like contributors. You also want to redirect bad behavior into something useful. So this isn't simply about this person but about how you lead your team to being fully engaged in what matters.

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