My company has decided to close for the day after the 4th with the statement “We are giving you and extended weekend -but- you have to use a vacation day”. I know it is sucky and cheap but my question is “Is this legal”?

31 Comments

1. AnonymousJune 24,2024 at 4:07PM UTC

   I think with the exception of maybe California which has very detailed and specific laws about sick time and vacation, it is in fact legal and may even be laid out in the employee handbook. If you were to say you didn't want to use a PTO day, your alternative would likely be to take the day unpaid.

2. AnonymousJune 24,2024 at 5:02PM UTC

   I should be legal. In the company I work for, Thursday the 4th is a holiday. Many employees are taking Friday the 5th off as well (covering it with PTO or Flex as needed).

3. AnonymousJune 24,2024 at 5:11PM UTC

   Nope. You can choose to take the day without pay.

4. Deborah Farrar StarkerJune 24,2024 at 5:33PM UTC

   I think it is the wording. They are not "giving you an extended weekend" They are closing and telling you to use a PTO day.

5. AnonymousJune 24,2024 at 6:06PM UTC

   I don't see on what grounds it would be illegal, as long as it applies to everyone equally. You don't really "own" your PTO, they do, and what the boss giveth the boss can taketh away.

6. AnonymousJune 24,2024 at 8:11PM UTC

   I am curious what exactly is "legal" when it comes to working July 4th- my husband's company told their employees that everyone has to work July 4th BUT they'll be closed July 5th in recognition of Independence Day. My husband asked if they would receive holiday pay for July 4th and was told no, because they are given the 5th off instead? Is that legal? We're in Minnesota.

7. AnonymousJune 25,2024 at 2:52PM UTC

   In MN, private employers are not required to provide paid or unpaid holiday leave. It's at the company's discretion to set a holiday schedule and for their policy to define holiday pay. It is common for hourly employees to be compensated an additional rate for hours worked on a company paid holiday, but typically salary workers do not receive additional compensation. Usually a salary worker may be granted an additional day off instead.

   When companies do not observe the actual holiday date itself - it's usually because there is a business need to stay open - think global companies where a Thursday off could have significant impacts to the business or not fulfill obligations to the customer. When a holiday falls mid-week like this, the company anticipates a large population to also take off the Friday - who wants to come back to work for one day and that day being Friday?? So having two days off for a lot of the org could be a pretty big impact.

   I don't agree with moving the holiday to July 5 but maybe some of my insight could help you understand the why. Ultimately, companies should plan their businesses better to accommodate holidays and short work weeks - we all know when holidays will fall and can plan accordingly.

   PS Your husband should take the 4th off :)

8. Joan Williams, Senior Talent Acquisition SpecialistJune 26,2024 at 1:42AM UTC

   Not necessarily illegal but I would suggest your husband check company policy/employee handbook/offer letter to see if there is any wording around paid Holidays. If any of those state that they observe Federal holidays, they may be violating their own company policy buy not observing July 4th. Then he could check with your State Labor Board.

9. AnonymousJune 25,2024 at 12:46PM UTC

   You would have to check this question with your state's labor board. A state or federal holiday does not federally require mandated time off or overtime (if working), so this is at the discretion of each state's Department of Labor. The only exception is that banks and other financial organizations are not allowed to be closed more than three days in a row, so being closed for a four-day weekend would not be an option for them. There are also some exceptions in healthcare and other essential services. Some companies allow people to take Friday along with Thursday but use PTO for Friday. To correctly answer, we would have to know your location.

10. AnonymousJune 25,2024 at 12:49PM UTC

    Ours has me and another worker on all 6 as usual. Mentally the burn out is real. If you don’t want to use the PTO tell them you’ll need to be let in? Michigan’s an at will state if we chose to not take the PTO here they’d just let us go. I had 2 Saturdays off next month and was excited until the entire company got email saying 10-6 is now manditory the 13th.

11. AnonymousJune 25,2024 at 12:56PM UTC

    Yes.

12. AnonymousJune 25,2024 at 12:57PM UTC

    Laws in every state differ. The 4th, while a federal 'holiday', is worked by retailers, restauranteurs, entertainment, sports facilities, sportsmen/women, etc. Companies can pay time and a half if they are generous, and in some states that is mandatory, if a company stays open that day. If you feel you need the day off, take PTO. on the 4th and enjoy a 4-day weekend. My workplace has 100 people working in the 4th and basically, we'd be terminated if we asked for any holiday off as leadership - we all go home 3 hours early which is nice. In reality, it's just another day.

13. maria roseJune 27,2024 at 8:30PM UTC

    The Fourth of July, while being a national federal holiday is one of the few remaining holidays that is celebrated on the exact day it occurs in the month. Unlike many other holidays that ar attached to make it part two f an extended weekend. I believe this is what the OP is asking about—the why the legal holiday doesn’t extend to the Friday to include it as well. I tend to follow the notion that holidays should fall on the actual day of the month not be attached to weekends to extend the time off because not everyone gets the holiday off with pay and not everyone gets those extended weekends. Obviously this is a private company where the OP works and they prefer to ONLY use their PTO days as extra time off days ( very similar to planned vacation days) and feel imposed upon to have use one of the PTO days to get paid for the extra day off on the holiday week, because they assumed that the company was either going to be open or would pay them an extra PTO day.despite knowing in advance that the 4th of July falls on a Thursday and that is a holiday federally mandated paid day on the calendar every year. We get the being upset but half the upset is caused by the OP assuming that they don’t have to keep PTO days handy for events like this and not plan them out as if they are guaranteed vacation days that can’t be changed especially when the calendar shows 4th of July holiday is a Thursday and not attached to the weekend. What if the company decided to make everyone come to work on the Friday, July 5th, 2024 would the OP be just as unhappy because they could not have an extended weekend. The OP here didn’t realize that the 4th of July holiday was not a weekend holiday but wanted it anyway but feels denied use of a PTO day to get paid for the Friday after despite the company stating that they were going to be closed and not doing business. The company has done the right legal choice knowing that the majority of the workers want the extended weekend but they don’t have to pay for the extra day off as a regular day of work—that’s what PTO is used for or just not get paid and get a lesser paycheck amount—either way the OP has the day off.

14. AnonymousJune 25,2024 at 1:52PM UTC

    At my company, both days are paid holidays. The 4th for Independence Day and the 5th is a Wellbeing Day.

15. AnonymousJune 26,2024 at 1:45PM UTC

    this doesn't answer the original poster's question.

16. Janice KallJune 25,2024 at 2:03PM UTC

    I believe this is legal, at least in my state. At my company we have two floating holidays so they ask us to use one of those, but if we already used them they ask us to take PTO.

    They gave us plenty of notice --told us in December that we needed to take that day off because the company would be closed.

17. Krystin MorganJune 25,2024 at 3:40PM UTC

    Yes, this is legal, at least in most states.

18. AnonymousJune 26,2024 at 11:30AM UTC

    Yes, it's legal. You have a choice. Take PTO or choose to take the day without pay. Either way there is no work that day. The company is closed.

19. AnonymousJune 26,2024 at 1:27PM UTC

    Medical industry in California- yes. It's super sucky.

20. AnonymousJune 26,2024 at 1:42PM UTC

    Yep, 100% legal.

    My company use to do this the day after Thanksgiving - but they actually would use your PTO for you (or put you negative if you didn't have 8hrs lol)

21. AnonymousJune 26,2024 at 1:44PM UTC

    So, they close for the day (I.E. there is no work for you to do regardless)- so I'm wondering if you can just take the day off "without pay"...IE, don't use your PTO? I supposed you could ask for that option....

22. maria roseJune 27,2024 at 2:03PM UTC

    The choice to get paid for the day is in your hands. The company has decided that the place is not open and they are not required to have to pay their employees for any days the company is not open. Enjoy the time off and if you really need the money from missing the paid day, use your PTO or vacation day to cover the cost of losing a day of paid work. PRO time is there to be used at any given time you are not being denied anything.

23. AnonymousJune 26,2024 at 5:04PM UTC

    Yes it is.

24. AnonymousJune 26,2024 at 5:07PM UTC

    No company is required to offer PTO. If they are closed, there is no work, and they are not required to pay you. You probably have the option of taking the day without pay or using PTO; you can ask that question. This is 100% legal and not at all unusual.

25. AnonymousJune 26,2024 at 5:35PM UTC

    yes it is, take the vacation day and enjoy it! No one goes to their grave wishing they worked one more day...life is short, have fun and Happy 4th.

26. AnonymousJune 27,2024 at 12:31PM UTC

    Yeah but sometimes you want to use your PTO for something else you WANT to do. I don't care about the 4th. I have PTO scheduled for trips in the fall. I'd be peeved if I was forced to use it in such a way.

27. AnonymousJune 27,2024 at 4:26PM UTC

    Sure of course, you can voice your displeasure with their decision but being angry about it openly will do you more harm than good. I am sure you will have more days ahead you can use and if you need more a good employer will let you go into the negative to take a day when you need it. No one is forcing you to work there if you don't like their rules.

28. AnonymousJune 26,2024 at 10:08PM UTC

    To clarify, are they closed on the 4th period or saying we're closed on the 4th, but it will count as a vacation day? Or, are they saying the day after the 4th can be used as a vacation day for the extended weekend?

29. Nicole Rae DrummondJune 27,2024 at 12:06PM UTC

    Basically - they can require exempt employees to use a PTO day however, if you’re exempt and don’t have PTO - the employer must ensure you maintain your exempt status and that might mean paying you for that day.

30. Autumn MeekerJune 27,2024 at 12:41PM UTC

    Based on another's comment, do they mean "we're closing so everyone is off but if you want paid, you'll have to use a vacation day" ? Meaning it's being treated as an unpaid holiday but if you want paid, you'll need to use a day of PTO.

    I agree this is weird but not surprising.

    Also, good point by another commenter about exempt vs nonexempt employees.

31. Michelle StewartJune 28,2024 at 2:45PM UTC

    This is quite common in factories - many people have to use their vacation for the two-week summer downtime or have to go unpaid. If it is for an extended period, there is an unemployment loophole.