Hello,

Anonymous

September 14,2023 at 6:40AM UTC

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Hello,

I work in a global office of about 10 people. The work atmosphere is fine but something has been bothering me. The matter is about ....lunch ( pls dont laugh...).. I feel left out everyday and that really demotivates me.

I used to have most of my lunches with my (male) colleague B. We would always ask around & include other people if they wanted to come (but most prefer to eat at their desk ). Now that the big boss (male also) has come back from a long stay oversea, both of them go for lunch together and I am consistently left out. That's the same for all coffee breaks or after work drinks. I realize they are both males and of the same age ( about a decade older than me ) but the situation bothers me for several reasons 1) work information are exchanged during these lunches / coffees/ drinks aso .. so obviously I don't have access to the same info as B although I am part of the senior management and at the same managerial level as him. 2) I cannot have lunch with my own team members as they prefer to take food from home & eat at their desk . As a result of this situation, I feel angry & excluded so I resent them ..which affects the work relationship and possibly my work .... I m a woman in my 40s so this kind of issue should not affect me so much...but it does. What would you do about it? I already talked to B. to explain how the new situation affects me, but he only rejects the responsibility to our boss. thanks for your thoughts ..

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AnonymousSeptember 14,2023 at 10:24AM UTC
Regarding the other staff: If the other employees are people you supervise, they may feel uncomfortable eating with you. More generally speaking they may just need that time to be alone (as an introvert and as a mom this is definitely the case with me). Lastly, they may not have the money or budget to eat out.
Have you asked your boss if you can join him for lunch? Or explained that you're concerned that you're missing out on pertinent work information?
Have you considered having an occasional lunch with someone you don't work with but who works nearby?
If you haven't already, I would start with these and then see if you can find something else that makes lunch special for you if you're still feeling angry, excluded, and/or resentful. Best of luck.
Nina JohnsonSeptember 14,2023 at 12:25PM UTC
I agree with the other reply that sometimes colleagues seek quiet time during lunch and not to take that personally. Regarding your boss and managerial peer, however, I can understand how it feels like you're missing out on casual work talk. While that may occur, keep in mind that your boss and the other manager may use more of that time not talking business and more in "buddy talk."
You spoke with the other manager and no invitations have been offered, so I would find other outlets for your lunch and after hours networking. Networking isn't just about making contacts for career moves - networking is a great way to stay up-to-date on different aspects of your industry or learn from other industries. In our area, we have "network after work" events (look in MeetUp, EventBrite for any near you). Does your field have a professional organization? If so, you can reach out to members who work nearby and arrange lunch or after work meetups. These can be both social as well as network building.
Do you have friends who work nearby? Even if they're in a different field, it can help to talk through work issues with an objective third party for new perspectives and ideas. Plus, you get to talk non-shop, too, and use lunch to de-stress.
I hope you find something that helps alleviate feeling "left out" - when you bring to the table some of the discussions you're having outside the office, your boss and peer may realize they're missing out! And, if they don't, you didn't sit around waiting on them and made it better for yourself.
AnonymousSeptember 18,2023 at 5:55AM UTC
spot on .. no invitations have been offered. thanks for all the good tips EVERYONE
AnonymousSeptember 14,2023 at 12:27PM UTC
I hate to be the one to tell you, but It is a guy thing.
Explorer539760September 14,2023 at 12:32PM UTC
Why not say @hey guys can I join you?” Or see how they feel about happy hour after work and buy them a round
Joan Williams, Senior Talent Acquisition SpecialistSeptember 16,2023 at 4:42AM UTC
Not for nothing but I would not appreciate if I worked for the OP and she suggested to the Big Boss that we implement an after work activity and he went for it. After work hours are my time.
Joan Williams, Senior Talent Acquisition SpecialistSeptember 16,2023 at 7:13PM UTC
I already have things to do after work. Extending my work day is not one of them.
Patricia HearringSeptember 17,2023 at 2:09AM UTC
I agree
work and home life don’t mix
Joan Williams, Senior Talent Acquisition SpecialistSeptember 17,2023 at 4:52AM UTC
Looks like I'm not the only one
https://www.wsj.com/lifestyle/careers/work-happy-hours-office-culture-4c901cfb?st=apjih4rop778hd8&reflink=article_email_share
AnonymousSeptember 17,2023 at 6:40AM UTC
You can arrange potlucks with your team and then you and they won't feel left out. It is hard to press someone to include you, if they left you out for a reason such as gender.
AnonymousSeptember 17,2023 at 12:44PM UTC
I work in a frat boy culture. I pack my lunch, eat at my desk, then take walks at lunch, or do my food shopping (we have a refrigerator) or run errands. Getting exercise or running errands is much more productive than listening to a couple of guys go on about sports, cigars, or how annoying their wives are. I've lost 13 pounds over the past year without even trying.
AnonymousSeptember 18,2023 at 5:46AM UTC
you are right! thats what i decided to do, thanks a lot EVERYBODY for your cleaver answers, I feel so much better now after reading all of you
AnonymousSeptember 18,2023 at 1:02PM UTC
Go girl!
AnonymousSeptember 18,2023 at 1:02PM UTC
Love this.
AnonymousSeptember 17,2023 at 5:29PM UTC
Ask the boss to include you? That should be part of the conversation easily put as an adult woman. Let him know that the social aspects of working together are something that you miss and you would like to join them. If they reject you from that then you just have to decide how important it is to be a part of their clique. Maybe during lunch you can spend that time looking for a more inclusive place to work, or train yourself in something new to get into a better or different role somewhere else. Isolation is never good and you do need breaks with others for a good work experience.
AnonymousSeptember 18,2023 at 5:50AM UTC
I have hinted it but it didnt work.. thanks for all your good suggestions
AnonymousSeptember 18,2023 at 12:30PM UTC
Don't hint, ask directly or create a lunch invite every week for both of them and you. As Sheryl Sandberg said "Lean In". Women only get seated at the table, when they just do it.
AnonymousSeptember 18,2023 at 1:02PM UTC
Don't hint. Be direct: "hey, I would like to take along with you guys and take part in the business conversation at lunch"..
IntentionGirl706330September 18,2023 at 12:30PM UTC
This. I would be direct, and simply state “I’ve been feeling out of the loop regarding xyz, and I’d love to join your next lunch to get up to speed”
AnonymousSeptember 18,2023 at 5:52AM UTC
'Happy' to see that I m not the only one:), thanks a lot for your suggestions
AnonymousSeptember 18,2023 at 1:00PM UTC
I think, deep down, your peer is Hurting your feelings because he is demonstrating friendship and loyalty toward the boss.. So you can't change him... All you can do is change yourself in your response. Take a hard look at your emotions and what is behind your reaction... Are you angry , jealous, lonely ? What would happen if your co-worker were moved to another office? Entirely? How would you feel then?... Understandably comma you have enjoyed this friendship and lunch time relationship, but your peer is trumping you...for a variety of reasons. Again...you can only control YOU. It's a disappointment, and you get to choose how to move on. You might consider asking the boss to be included in these lunches so that you can be part of any business conversation. But other than that, you probably just need to move on mentally.
AnonymousSeptember 18,2023 at 2:00PM UTC
Pretty sure this is a Chatbot response. Comma as a name, really?
to the OP you're valid in feeling angry and resentful about being excluded. That good ole boys club costs a lot of women the opportunity to advance and participate. Would you feel comfortable approaching the big boss and tell him how what you feel and how you see this behavior?
AnonymousSeptember 21,2023 at 8:20AM UTC
HI, thanks for your understanding. I thought of telling him when he invites us (= the rest of the team) for the yearly xmas lunch ( it's comming soon as he alreayd mentionned it ) and ask me to organize it ( thats what he usually does). I thought of telling him that 1 lunch a year and the rest of the time alone isn't inclusive at all, and that I would prefer more inclusion on a regular basis rather than 1 Xmas lunch that sounds like some kind of obligation for him . ..your thoughts?
AnonymousSeptember 21,2023 at 1:02PM UTC
It is really going to depend on how close/comfortable you feel with your management. I tend to be a very up-front person so I would ask for a 1:1 and tell him how I'm feeling about the whole situation. That I feel I am being excluded, that it is impacting my current work as well as any future potential development opportunities to be involved with projects and workflows that could benefit the company. I would emphasize the career/skills development aspect of it rather than the focus on the personal feelings of hurt and frustration. I would also try to keep it in a positive theme and focus on how his exclusionary behavior could negatively impact the team and the company.
Now having said that, I do not tend to be the most 'political' person and it has cost me, but I've stayed true to myself and people in my company know me as someone who will be straightforward with them. Most have seen it as a strength and the few who didn't, well they're not with the company anymore (for their own various reasons). Only you can judge wither your management is going to be open to this kind of approach.
AnonymousSeptember 19,2023 at 3:03PM UTC
Just because you do not like to bring your lunch and eat at your desk, doesn't mean you are entitled to look down on those who do and ascribe negative connotations to EATING LUNCH in a way the eater wants to eat it.
AnonymousSeptember 19,2023 at 6:13PM UTC
wow, think you read way more in that post than is there. Might want to check yourself as to why it created such a negative reaction in you.
AnonymousSeptember 21,2023 at 8:29AM UTC
Hi, sorry that's not how I meant it. not looking down at all , just trying to explain the background & the reasons why i feel isolated. English is not my mother tongue.