Sexism in the work place

Orlagh Costello

October 16,2023 at 1:12PM UTC

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Sexism in the work place

I had 2 conversations in the last week in my workplace about sexism I've experienced. Now, I'm 20+ yrs an engineer, so sexism is no new thing for me, but I was incredibly disappointed by the first conversation. In the context of some issues we are experiencing with a team, I told a colleague, who has shown good DEI (diversity, equity and inclusion awareness before now) about some examples of sexism I had experienced from certain members of the team. His response was "I would be disappointed if that was the case. I have never seen any sexism in the team."

Those of you who have been through this will know how common this response is and also how disappointing it is to not be believed.

The second one, possibly more important, was with my line manager. I explained in a similar manner what had been going on (warning him beforehand this was an FYI, not something I needed him involved in) and his response was much more in line with what I expected. As well as a "I know you can handle this, but you shouldn't have to. Keep me informed and if we need to get HR involved, we will" he also just believed me. He was disappointed and shocked, but didn't question that I recognised sexism when I experienced it.

I've had my faith in the organisation restored to a certain extent after the second conversation. As for the colleague - well yes, it will colour my dealings with him to some extent, but aside from disappointment, there's no real effect on me.

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Shelby COctober 16,2023 at 2:21PM UTC
I'm sorry. I don't see the question here. Hopefully, my response will still be helpful and bring you some comfort:
I'm glad that you had a more positive experience the second time. In my experience, management is more likely to cover up potential employee issues for a myriad of reasons than a fellow employee. When they cover for someone, it's usually due to a friendship.
The first sentence from your colleague, where he stated he "would be disappointed if that was the case", infers to me that he has some reason to disbelieve what you're telling him. I don't think any of us would take kindly to having someone insinuate that we're being less than truthful. I would feel like I had politely been called out as a liar. Plus, who wants to add that to a potentially traumatic experience a/o traumatizing environment?
Best case scenario, he's attempting to reconcile in his mind how someone he personally knows, likes, respects, admires (insert positive word here) could possibly behave that way. He may even attempt to be justifying it because we all make mistakes. Yet that still does not fix that it was very poorly communicated to you.
If he had only stated that he hasn't seen any sexism in the team, while it may be insensitive, it's his experience. It's speaking to what he knows and his personal truth. Both of you can be right at the same time. Presumably, as a colleague, he's not the ideal person to discuss your concerns with anyway which is why I suspect you took it to your Line Manager who handled it appropriately.
Whatever the intent behind his statement was, you have a problem that needs to be addressed. While you are addressing it, you may suggest (or have your Line Manager do so) that the entire department could benefit from refresher DEI .training.
I wish you all the best.
AnonymousOctober 16,2023 at 2:51PM UTC
The first person lacks empathy and speaks from a privileged position. The second one has a more appropriate understanding of what marginalized people go through. I would have been insulted as you were by the first person implying that I was lying or embellishing the truth to make it fit some point. It's too late for a "snap back," and I wish I had one. The only ones I can think of would probably get me fired.
Alexis GladstoneOctober 17,2023 at 12:35PM UTC
I remember years ago being at an internal senior leadership conference, where I was one of the session designers and facilitators (not a senior leader) and as the main session ended for a break, someone blatantly felt me up my rear. I was so upset and told a friend who insisted I tell my manager, the division HR VP. His response, "are you sure?" I was shocked. While there was nothing that could be done because I had no idea who did it in the throngs or people, it still hurt.
Here we over 20 years later and some responses are still the same. It sounds like your manager has taken any DEI&B training to heart, or just has strong emotional intelligence on their own. While I too would be disappointed in your colleague's response, your manager gives me hope.
Shelby COctober 17,2023 at 1:55PM UTC
Wow, Alexis. I'm so sorry that happened to you and was handled so poorly.
Sarah BordersOctober 17,2023 at 1:28PM UTC
Wow. I hope someone has an opportunity to coach your colleague. If he has good DEI awareness, he should know better, but since he’s been dismissive of your experience, it’s clear he doesn’t. At the very least, though, he should be receptive to correction.
AnonymousOctober 17,2023 at 4:35PM UTC
If I were you I would pull aside that colleague, repeat what he said in response to your commentary and remind him that having a penis means he would not likely have experienced that and if he saw it would not know it because it does not affect him. Let him know that from him you expect empathy and to not question your words because you speak truth to the situation and want him to be a part of not allowing it to happen in your team. If need be bring HR into the mix with your very supportive manager who clearly gets it. As an alternative you could ask your manager to pull this person aside but you're a grown woman and should easily put that person in his place. Not everyone is perfect and some folks just don't see what is right in front of their eyes. Be the change and show this person how wrong what you dealt with was and that it won't be tolerated going forward.
Orlagh CostelloOctober 19,2023 at 12:24PM UTC
Hi all, wasn't really asking a question, as such, more just sharing how the different responses and the different approaches can colour what happens moving forward. But thanks for the comments - I've been dealing with the shit for 20 years and it gets tiring. But having a more senior leader respond in a supportive rather then dismissive manner gives me hope. Fingers crossed the generations coming after me won't deal with this sort of thing.
AnonymousOctober 19,2023 at 12:32PM UTC
I also work as an engineer (>30 years) and currently experience and have experienced sexism. The GASLIGHTING that you describe with first collegue is SO COMMON. The glass ceiling is real and gets worse if you are over 40. HR (my representative is female) is USELESS - they exist to protect the company only - no trust there. If you challenge anything, management behaves like junior high school popular kids and you get bullied. I just focus my attention on my own business outside the corporate world. I would never want my children have the same career experience - I steered them all away from engineering.
Orlagh CostelloOctober 20,2023 at 12:36PM UTC
Ah I'm 43, been dealing with shit like this for years. I was just pleasantly surprised by my manager's approach though
AnonymousOctober 21,2023 at 12:01AM UTC
Seems like a rare bird! I'm glad there are signs of progress for you.
LORI-ANN BURLINGAMEOctober 19,2023 at 2:29PM UTC
Sexism exists on all levels in the buisness worlld. A lack of leadership and insecurity on the part of managements helps it grow.
Check your company handbook and policy manual on sexism. What steps can you take to have your voice heard and to protect yourself?
Think strategy. Don't give anyone else an advantage over you by discussing this with too many others. Unfortunately, people may turn on you.
In addition, you may want to call your local Legal Aid Society or Bar Association chapter for some legal advice. Your local area law schools may also have a legal clinic that you can reach out to.
As a former labor relations specialist, I have seen workers and coworkers turn on each other. No one wants to be held accountable for their actions. Be careful and document events as they occur.
Orlagh CostelloOctober 20,2023 at 12:36PM UTC
It's a bit of a different situation in Ireland mind, so we don't have many law schools etc, but I've dealt with this from both sides before now. This isn't something I'll be bringing to a HR route unless it was a lot worse than it currently is :)
AnonymousOctober 22,2023 at 2:24PM UTC
I'm sorry for your bad experience. I think it's happening around the globe with our 'evolutionary humanity.' I think it's worse than COVID-19, and it is spreading like normal behavior. Since immemorial times, they've done it against women. I highly recommend starting to study the patriarchal history of the world. Plus, try to understand the narcissistic threats and how they are becoming stronger day by day. It's not about you as a girl; it's all about them trying to destroy us in a variety of ways.