I just had a situation happen with my direct report that is honestly mind-blowing.

149 Comments

1. AnonymousDecember 8,2023 at 12:44AM UTC

   I agree that something is going on with her. Regarding transactional boundaries, I would say, yes, keep it like that. Obviously she does not want or need anything more. If she needs help she should ask. You are not her friend, you are her boss.

2. AnonymousDecember 8,2023 at 1:19AM UTC

   Thanks for your response. I’m honestly angry at this point that she is putting whatever is going on with her on me as well. But you’re absolutely right, I am her boss.

3. AnonymousDecember 8,2023 at 3:14AM UTC

   Do the best you can- good morning, good night, your assignment., all cheerful

   If she asks why you seem distant in the future, remind her of you are there if she needs something but respect boundaries.

   Her therapist probably recommended something I suppose.

   On a personal note, I can see why you feel like you do but know you are awesome and the situation that brought you to today is out of your control no matter how you want to put people before business (as it should be! Can't always be all business but I guess for now it is)

4. AnonymousDecember 8,2023 at 1:20PM UTC

   Thanks again. I’m so confused by what she said but I agree there’s something serious going on with her. I plan on just doing what I’m obligated to as a supervisor but nothing more.

   And thanks to you and the few others who were kind while providing constructive advice and remarks. Some of these people seem to jump to me as being overbearing and "all up in her business." That has SO not been the case. Maybe she felt too comfortable and overshared with me, but I have not told her anything I wouldn't say to another co-worker. As a leader, I do think it's important to get to know your direct reports on a surface level but I also do not believe in being intrusive. Everyone has a life outside of the office.

5. AnonymousDecember 8,2023 at 4:17AM UTC

   Gain some distance by giving you both the space to reset your boundaries and redefine how you'll relate. This is a learning moment for you too. This is not your mentee and you are not her mentor.

   Not every relationship needs to be defined and this one will definitely require time and boundaries because this person is clearly dealing with some serious personal issue.

   I suggest you focus on expectations at work and getting things completed. Keep the personal to a minimum for the time being but cordial. Try not to let things get weird.

6. AnonymousDecember 8,2023 at 5:15PM UTC

   I'm not sure how it's not going to be weird, but yeah, I'm focusing on expectations and task assignments and completion. If she needs help, she can ask, but otherwise, I will keep things separate and keep the work fairly independent. I saw us as a team, but that obviously does not work for her.

7. AnonymousDecember 8,2023 at 12:57PM UTC

   To be honest, who decided that you were her mentor? And did she agree to being a mentee? Also, when I read this it's a lot about YOU when you shared you were trying to be there for her. Pause. "I'm being made to feel"..... you decide on how you let someone else control how you feel? Please know your sincerity does shine from your words, but this sounds like there are some continued opportunities to have more in place limits. Change back to your office for any future 'mentor/mentee' times. Did you get her official buy in for this? You may look at this as a mentor relationship but does she? Also, and again, so kind of you to care this much, but often when someone is put in a situation with obligatory talk they could be nervous and just unload. She may have never felt comfortable doing that but was new, etc. Allow her to drive this now.

8. AnonymousDecember 8,2023 at 1:14PM UTC

   She has stated that she looks to me as a mentor, including the conversation yesterday. So yes, I took it as such. I’ve never pried into her personal life; anything she has told me came about unprompted. But I’m definitely resetting those boundaries at this point. Thank you for the direct feedback. I’ve had some sleep and time to process; I see this now as someone who is dealing with some mental health issues.

9. AnonymousDecember 8,2023 at 1:39PM UTC

   her therapists has given her an assignment to do. You just got caught in the middle. She has most likely been lumping everything into one bucket with her therapists and the therapists is trying to help her set boundaries. The problem is the therapists doesn't know what is what and is only going by one side.

   Now comes the fun part on how you handle this. I would do a CYA and journal interactions, behaviors and your communications. I know this sounds like a royal pain and it is. But it will be necessary down the road if you ever need to do a PIP. It will also allow you to provide factual professional guidance. It sounds like you have a good foundation yourself on employee development and relations. It is hard when you have invested a lot of time and energy. Just don't let her take you down.

10. AnonymousDecember 8,2023 at 2:34PM UTC

    My friend (who doesn't work at my company) suggested the same, which I plan to start today. I'm frankly disappointed in this individual's lack of maturity and angry at myself for wasting my energy and time. Thanks for trying to frame this for me as positively as possible. I appreciate everyone's comments.

11. AnonymousDecember 8,2023 at 2:37PM UTC

    The boundaries she's suggesting are for me to NOT be personable and instead be transactional. Maybe you should read fully what I posted and not just skim for the highlights. Additionally, when she calls me crying, proceeds to tell me she's in therapy, discloses she's not talking to her mother, past emotional outbursts, etc...yes, this is a mental health issue clearly.

12. AnonymousDecember 8,2023 at 5:06PM UTC

    The only reason I even know about her personal life is BECAUSE she brought it up with me. Some of you seem to act like I wanted to know ALL about her personal life. Trust me, that is not the case. But thanks for making some gross assumptions. Are you telling me the next time an employee comes in my office, crying, telling me she just broke up with her boyfriend that I should stop them, tell them "This is too personal!" And then walk them out? So we should all be robots? Are you a robot? *Checks self* Nope, definitely not a robot.

13. AnonymousDecember 9,2023 at 3:43PM UTC

    You're making this all about you and that shows little emotional intelligence. Check yourself here. Her need for better boundaries and a much different kind of bods is not personal and you taking all of this as a personal affront and being angry shows little professional maturity. This may be an opportunity for you to grow as a manager. The world of managing people is quickly evolving. It's not a one size fits all and all your years of experience and modeling after an former manager may have you stuck in the past. There's nothing wrong with learning a better way. This is only one instance showing you a path of growth.

14. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 4:40AM UTC

    I’m not making this about me. I respect her request. But I’m also a human being with thoughts and feelings of my own.

15. AnonymousDecember 8,2023 at 5:07PM UTC

    I work in healthcare, so I witness these things firsthand. Thanks for being so judgemental.

16. AnonymousDecember 8,2023 at 6:25PM UTC

    The way I'm interpreting this is that she's now aware that she doesn't have appropriate professional boundaries and feels exposed because she has shared a lot of personal information with you. She's now asking you to help her hold that line.

    I understand your feelings of sadness, anger and disappointment but they also point to how personally invested you've become in this relationship, perhaps also contributing to the blurred boundary. You seem like you genuinely want to teach her the the professional ropes, so perhaps you can try to shift your perspective on this and accept it as an opportunity to reset and redefine the mutual expectations of your working relationship.

    Yes, it's nice to be friendly at work but it's even nicer to keep it balanced with professional behaviors and boundaries.

17. AnonymousDecember 8,2023 at 6:40PM UTC

    Appreciate this perspective; it makes a lot of sense, especially because I'm aware of her sharing some of this same info with a co-worker who just recently started in our office. I was a little surprised she shared so much so quickly but didn't say anything because it's not my business.

    And yes, I'm going to redirect my approach. Personally, I have great relationships with many of my previous supervisors and stay in touch with many of them. But that's me; I've always known where the boundaries lie. And I also don't share such personal things with them, but again, she told me these things unprompted so I wanted to be supportive. But yes, I will listen and redirect any conversation so it stays solely professional.

18. AnonymousDecember 8,2023 at 8:45PM UTC

    The therapist seemingly envisioned an "enmeshed" relationship between you and her. Even if that isn't your interpretation, it may be how your employee presented it to the therapist. It is best to cut out the happy hours and leave the work to the office. Make her accountable for her tasks, and do not hold her hand. The therapist seems to think this is what she needs.

19. AnonymousDecember 8,2023 at 9:05PM UTC

    Thank you so much for providing this! In case anyone else is curious, I did some research: https://psychcentral.com/lib/tips-on-setting-boundaries-in-enmeshed-relationships Wow! If this is what's going on, it is definitely one-sided. I've never expected her to always agree or go along with proposals; as the boss, it's always my call, but I do discuss decisions as appropriate. My last boss did that with me, which I absolutely respected about her. She always took the time to explain why she wanted something done a certain way. I learned a lot from that approach and have adopted it as my own. Again, thank you so much for sharing. This explains a lot.

20. AnonymousDecember 8,2023 at 10:46PM UTC

    Always remember that you are in a position of power as her manager, and what you consider "suggestions" are often considered "orders" to your subordinates. It sounds like she feels like doing anything you suggest is what you expect, and a happy hour suggestion could be one such thing. This was one of my most rude awakenings as a new manager. Most employees did not respond to the same things I did in the same way. Few would give it even when I asked for honest and frank feedback. Most would only say what they thought I wanted to hear and do what they thought I wanted them to do.

21. AnonymousDecember 9,2023 at 12:08AM UTC

    Why are you being "made to feel" a certain way.
    You are being blamed for something you didn't do, and you get to choose how you feel about it. Set some firm boundaries with this employee, business only, and any acting out/outbursts get disciplinary action and firing.

22. AnonymousDecember 9,2023 at 4:45AM UTC

    Maybe a bad phrase selection on my part. I don’t appreciate this employee creating drama where there was none previously and don’t appreciate her trying to make her issues mine. I’ve tried to be an understanding boss, but yes, from this point forward business only and I’ll utilize progressive discipline per our company’s policies. And absolutely, I’ve stayed out of her business. It’s been completely her choice to over share.

23. M CDDecember 9,2023 at 11:23AM UTC

    I'm sorry that happened, I experienced a kind of outburst like this / confrontation from one of my directs when they were going through something and I agree it does make you sad.

    I highly recommend you don't go to happy hour with your direct reports anymore. Maybe it's just the line of work that I'm in, but I don't think that's appropriate at all. And it opens up the door to too many potential ways that someone could share something about their personal life etc. Work + alcohol don't mix. Even if a person just has a soda or water during happy hour, I don't think it's the right environment. Take them out to lunch sometime if you want. But I wouldn't be doing happy hour, or not unless it was a larger event where other managers and people were there too. I'm just saying I wouldn't be doing it weekly with just me and my direct, the way you described.

    Other than that I think you just respect her request like you said, doesn't sound like you did anything wrong, be more transactional if that's how it has to be. It's definitely going to change the vibe of your relationship, and I know that sucks.

    I also wonder if the way she worded this to you was her way of telling you she doesn't want to go to happy hour anymore. I don't know what she meant about the conversation part of it. Maybe she's trying to say she doesn't want to tell you about her personal life anymore? So ok, you won't ask? But it's a 2 way street, how much of it was you asking vs her just telling you and volunteering it. It's kind of ripping the band aid off, but yeah like you said, respect her request, be more transactional, I'd also say stop doing the happy hours.

    And if she brings up anything personal now, after the fact, you can nicely remind her that there need to be boundaries at work and let's stay focused on the business topics at hand (or however you want to say it, in a kind way - I feel like the way I wrote it sounds sarcastic and I don't mean for it to come off that way)

    Hugs and best of luck

24. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 4:37AM UTC

    we just did a happy hour monthly, not weekly. Weekly would have been SUPER inappropriate. My work environment is not super formal, so it is not uncommon (I work in healthcare in a major downtown area). But I get what you’re saying and probably will never do this again with anyone.

    other than the typical getting to know you questions (where you from, got pets, food, etc) all the super personal stuff was shared by her unsolicited. She told me about breaking up with her boyfriend after a training session we put on. It was a little odd, but she said she did it because she was afraid the situation was going to impact work. I always try to keep it light and have never told her anything super personal; she doesn’t need to know any of that.

    thanks for the words of encouragement. :). lol it’ll be ok. And thanks for not trying to destroy me like some of these other posters!

25. M CDDecember 14,2023 at 11:44AM UTC

    Lol you're welcome! Sorry I misunderstood, idk why I thought or just assumed it was a weekly happy hour (d'oh!) You got this. I saw your updated note about your 1x1 with her. Good job on being a manager who actually cares - there are too many out there who don't! Oh and thank you for your service! (army brat here - HOOAH :))

26. AnonymousDecember 9,2023 at 1:27PM UTC

    I imagine that this can be hard for you to understand from your point of view as her boss.

    Try not to take it personally because it seems that she really has difficulties with setting boundaries, with anyone. She must be an empath who is like a sponge when it comes to other people's emotions. It's possible that you have had a conversation where your difficulties were shining through (private or professional) and since you are her boss it must have been overwhelming to her to hear that even you have difficulties. The line between being a friend and being a colleague has also blurred so that she can not handle your vulnerability (because you are her boss at the same time).

    So:

    1) Don't be upset, the information that she provided to you are about her. She is overwhelmed and needs firmer boundaries.

    2) You can help her (as your employee) to finde the balance by acting professionally.

    3) Maybe one day you are going to have her as a friend again (but possibly not at this workplace.)

27. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 4:30AM UTC

    I think my initial feelings came from being confused and not really understanding what she was trying to say. I still don’t really get it, but also know everyone is different and will at least support her from afar and of course professionally. Trust me, I don’t need her to be my friend so that’s not something I’m really interested in going forward. We can be colleagues one day.

28. AnonymousDecember 9,2023 at 1:33PM UTC

    Managers should not attend 'happy hours' with direct reports, unless it is something the company sponsors (like a holiday party) with all invited. Managers shouldn't invite directs over for dinner, unless, again, it is a company sponsored affair and everyone is invited. She is telling you she's uncomfortable with whatever level of info you're sharing and whatever relationship you've tried to build with her. Perhaps you don't want to be "transactional," but based on what you've said she's shared, the safest place for you both to be is in a transactional relationship. Work is transactional. If she needs help, recommend EAP. If she starts to have performance problems, guess what? your personal life will become fodder for HR and you- the manager- will be blamed.

29. AnonymousDecember 9,2023 at 3:42PM UTC

    Some of this depends on the company.
    I am required to take my direct reports to lunch once a month and dinner once a quarter. If I do it as a group and someone can’t attend, I have to reschedule a 1:1 with the person who missed. We don’t talk about personal lives, but I am supposed to use these as coaching sessions working towards the goals outlined in performance reviews. I’m sure HR would accommodate someone not wanting to attend, but I’m also sure it would impact advancement. In that way, this sort of mentorship relationship could impact her career progression. If the OPs boss wants to extend Happy Hour to the whole dept. it’s clearly valued.

30. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 4:26AM UTC

    Exactly. It’s looked at as a chance to change venues and connect in a different environment. If it was going on frequently I could absolutely see it as a major issue. As I said earlier, this was my employee’s idea originally to get to know each other and discuss work.

31. April LineDecember 9,2023 at 1:44PM UTC

    Agree with everyone who said she's getting assignments in therapy and that she is probably not all the way accurate in what she's reporting to her therapist.

    And here's some perspective: as a recovering people pleaser who's had a lot of trouble with boundaries and has been in therapy for like 15 years now, it's very likely your direct report is from a home where she was either parentified or had highly volatile and emotionally immature parents.

    It is a big sign of growth that she was able to ask you for better boundary setting and it's also a sign that she trusts you and the relationship. So be proud of that, regardless of how clumsily she put it out there. She is learning and growing!

    Suggest:

    1) asking her if she wants your feedback/mentorship before offering it.

    2) really look at your own feelings here. Being friendly with work people is one thing. Hitching your sense of self worth to being liked is something else. The hardest thing about being the boss is you always have to be the grownup in the room, and you letting your feelings about this healthy request from your direct report affect how you interact with her is an indication that you're faltering there.

    3) now that you both have had some time, you can totally say, "hey i am having a hard time figuring out how to proceed in light of your request for better boundaries. It seems like you would prefer that we communicate only about work. Does that sound right?" And see what she says. But please don't make your feelings her responsibility. Because they are not. She is not making you feel anything. Your feelings are yours.

    Good luck!

32. GirlBossanova934974December 9,2023 at 2:13PM UTC

    From my viewpoint, there is way too much going on here for a professional workplace relationship. As some have already stated, avoid going out to Happy Hours etc with direct reports unless they are holiday events or special occasions. This direct report has a lot of personal issues going on which you do not need to be part of.

33. Liz RamosDecember 9,2023 at 2:37PM UTC

    Just want to say you sound awesome it is definitely something going on with her. I appreciate leaders like you. I will say some people just want to be a worker bee with an assignment no small talk some people want a that extra mentorship some people want something in between

34. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 4:12AM UTC

    Yeah I’m disappointed but not going to spend too much time worrying about it. Thanks so much for the kind words!

35. AnonymousDecember 9,2023 at 3:09PM UTC

    I just want to say that I love that you took the step of asking for advice on this forum.
    You sound like a nice person who is trying to bridge the gap between generations in the workplace which is hard pretty much no matter what.

    My personal experience is more from her side of things. I personally am not a fan of happy hours at all so I agree that maybe finding another option or even just having a good old check in as subtle as you can make it may be just better. I know it is tricky, though, because those check ins can feel intimidating. My two cents is just that it sounds like safer boundary setting for her just to have her relationship with you within work and not going out anyway where. Overall I agree with people saying it’s mostly not from you that her negative feelings are from, but just try your best to offer grace to her and I would maybe mention to your superior that she spoke with you about boundaries in relation to some significant personal things she is dealing with and you think you may need to change the way you meet.

36. AnonymousDecember 9,2023 at 3:16PM UTC

    Definitely give yourself credit as you can for the happy hour idea and try to talk to your superior about concrete examples of how you know it has worked well…

    You’re not wrong that what you are dealing with is a bit mind blowing. Personally I don’t condone the amount of co-habitation happening these days but I also know it’s really hard to afford living on your own as a single woman especially. She is facing that pressure very much so now…

    I guess just keep that in mind but also keep her on watchlist as far as performance goes. By telling you she goes to therapy she is probably trying not to play the victim but just express she wants to work on things.

    Have you mentioned the meeting “outbursts” to her? Maybe try to talk through healthy ways to disagree at your workplace with both her and maybe your superior as well, or set up a general sort of meeting about it with everyone. Personally I think it is healthy to express disagreement in a workplace and really don’t like how office culture does not give a good parameter for healthy conflict and even creative ideas through dynamics. It’s good that she is willing to speak up in this way but ideally it wouldn’t be spontaneously happening in meetings in an embarrassing way for you

37. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 4:10AM UTC

    Thanks so much! I have addressed both instances the same day they have happened. Definitely from a place of trying to understand what she thought happened, and then discussing better strategies going forward. She’s been receptive both times. I sometimes use myself as an example; I may not agree with what’s going on during the meeting, but there are better strategies than reacting. But yes, I plan on continuing to hold her accountable.

38. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 8:51PM UTC

    Your post is super relatable for everyone. It's hard to hold all of these tensions together. Thanks again for sharing - it was good to think it through with you reflecting on my own experiences as well.

39. Goalsetter498760December 9,2023 at 3:15PM UTC

    You sound like a person who really cares about your employee and that's so great! Please don't stop caring.

    Please do your best to remember and remind (or even tell yourself for the first time) that a person's boundaries are honestly not about you. They really aren't.

    A real boundary is for the person setting it, and it's about that person's behavior and needs.

    I know it really feels like it because of how this played out, but her boundaries are absolutely not personal.

    It's about how *she* needs to act in response to different stimuli.

40. AnonymousDecember 9,2023 at 3:36PM UTC

    I would recommend documenting this in some way that the employee has specifically said they don’t want a mentorship relationship and that you are suspending coaching plans as a result. I’d ask HR to include it as a note to file in her record. The reason is that while she is saying she doesn’t want this, if you move on to another potential mentee and become transactional with her, she may view it as retaliatory. I don’t think it is, but best to have your ducks in a row.

41. Heather MattissonDecember 9,2023 at 3:52PM UTC

    I love this post from Anonymous, because she does get at the potential for danger here.
    The young lady is taking some courageous steps by going to therapy and being open with you about how she feels. The fact that she trusts you is beautiful validation of the way you've managed her and modeled a sense of belonging for her - well done. In reading your post though it sounds like she's "telling" you that she needs to set boundaries, but something leads me to believe that she's really vacillating between co-dependent and healthy behaviors in your work relationship. This is not unexpected as people learn to stand in their own power. That means that she may unconsciously be relying on you for validation of her inherent worth and twisting your relationship in a way, and that can be extremely disruptive in a working relationship. I agree with the other posters that you may want to reduce some of the opportunities for personal sharing and focus on the work. Otherwise, as it sounds like you're experiencing, she may ask you to carry parts of the working relationship that she's not ready to, but must, carry herself. Second, based on my own personal experience in situations like this (situations were reversed - my boss exhibited narcissistic and co-dependent behaviors), definitely include your HR person as a guide and consultant to help you navigate this situation.

42. Cat the CoachDecember 9,2023 at 7:16PM UTC

    She never said she didn't want a mentor. She said she was working on establishing better boundaries. She may have done it clumsily because she's not used to setting boundaries and it was probably a bit awkward on both sides. I don't see why she couldn't still be mentored as long as the focus is on work and not personal. Any good mentor/mentee relationship starts with a clear agreement on the purpose and expectations of each party, and perhaps now would be the time to clarify that. BTW you sound like a great boss and I hope you both can find a way forward that feels good. Hard not to take it personally but please continue to be your kind, caring self.

43. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 4:52AM UTC

    Thanks so much! I really try to be a good boss and I’m honestly bummed by the negative comments from people that I’m (paraphrasing) a horrible boss.

44. AnonymousDecember 9,2023 at 8:51PM UTC

    Great suggestion!

45. AnonymousDecember 9,2023 at 3:38PM UTC

    Some of its company culture. If the company has a strong sense of coaching and mentorship the. Those sorts of meetings are expected. It shouldn’t relate to personal lives, but from what the OP said they mostly discuss work and training.

46. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 4:19AM UTC

    This is completely not uncommon at my company (we’re located in downtown of a major city).

47. AnonymousDecember 9,2023 at 4:24PM UTC

    ok I had to read twice to try and better understand. I am on your report's side here. To me personally you seem overbearing as a manager. The reason why she told you all of this personal information about her is because she felt awkward at your happy hour outings, as many people pleasers she's most likely an introvert and we are burdened by awkward silences in the conversation, so to fill the silence we start spilling stuff we never intended to spill about our lives. And then we regret it. It happened to me so many times when I was younger, with age I learned not to care about silence and no longer do it but she sounds very young so this is a big possibility. I personally would absolutely hate to be out for happy hour and especially dinner with spouses with my boss and I LOVE my boss. It's just something I feel is inappropriate and invasive especially because you feel like you can't say no and forced to go. I have 2 direct reports now and I would never go out after work with them especially every week!? Unless it's a holiday or special occasion. So my thoughts are that she expressed that to her therapist and therapist suggested putting up those professional boundaries. All this aside I don't think you're a bad manager, I know you're coming from a good place but you need to realize that literally every person is different, there are thousands and thousands of personalities and they might not match your own. What you consider a pleasant outing might be complete opposite for her. Maybe the kind of relationship she wants with you is only you giving her assignments and telling her due date and you have to respect that. You should not be upset about this at all or feel any kind of way about it. No one is bad in this situation its just different personalities at work and THATS OK!

48. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 4:03AM UTC

    So for clarification, happy hour was monthly not weekly. I don’t have time for that. It was also originally her suggestion and was just the two of us. That would be beyond odd to invite spouses. I also didn’t mention inviting spouses, so not sure where you got that? She’s 27, but I agree she is very immature. I’m a direct communicator and have a strong personality, which isn’t the first time someone has described me as overbearing.

49. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 2:29PM UTC

    You wrote in the original post that you invited her and her boyfriend at the time to dinner with you and your husband. She was saying that she feels it’s inappropriate to suggest those kinds of things because direct reports can feel pressured and I get what she’s saying

    My team also did monthly happy hours and I hated it. I have a difficult personal life. I don’t want to be asked about it at work even with good intentions. Even simply asking me what my plans are for new years sounds innocent but I have a lonely life so I’m uncomfortable and embarrassed admitting I have no plans. Those who don’t experience this don’t always understand why some people are uncomfortable having anything personal come up at work. The questions being asked at the happy hour might not seem invasive but to someone struggling with a bad personal life it can be

50. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 7:59PM UTC

    So I’m damned if I do, damned if I don’t.

51. AnonymousDecember 11,2023 at 8:14PM UTC

    yes pretty much damned if you do/don't, that's why its best to keep it strictly professional with your reports which means - nothing outside just working relationship.

52. AnonymousDecember 9,2023 at 5:06PM UTC

    All I can say is in my professional life I have never had a boss like you, and I wish I had. You sound terrific.

53. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 4:58AM UTC

    Aww, thank you so much! As weird as it sounds, I learned how to be a manager in the military. They honestly provide the best leadership training.

54. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 10:22PM UTC

    Also, I may have screenshotted this to remind me I’m doing ok at this boss gig. :)

55. AnonymousDecember 9,2023 at 5:39PM UTC

    Number 1- do not take any of this personally!!!

    What people are going through is about how they are navigating the things happening in their lives and how they respond to their own situations.

    If she’s in therapy she is likely uncovering a lot of things about her past and how her own behaviors have impacted where she is. Boundary setting is a big therapy topic, and often people are made to recognize that they’re people pleasers who fail to set appropriate boundaries, which allows others to take advantage of them. This revelation can be both helpful and frightening, as you then have to question every close relationship you have. Continue to support her professionally, allow her to work through her thoughts & feelings, and continue to be understanding of her journey to learn to set boundaries. If that includes talking about her personal life less with you just understand that’s about her healing and not about anything wrong you’ve done. It’s her journey and is not your fault.

56. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 3:58AM UTC

    This was very kindly put. I appreciate the understanding comments like this, that also are direct.

57. AnonymousDecember 9,2023 at 6:44PM UTC

    she's struggling. it's obvious. and she's now overreacting and deflecting things her therapist told her. Back off. it's NOT YOU. there's a storm brewing and you want to be far away when it happens, cause the garbage is gonna fly in all kinds of directions. Pray for her. Be Cordial. Do your job. Stay out of her business in any fashion or manner. Rise above. Do not personalize this whatsoever...and if you ARE personalizing too much, perhaps you need to look at that reaction (?). Overall, I see an emotional storm happening on her boat, and you don't want to be on when it happens. Observe her requests (and your observations) and keep distance. The end.

58. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 3:56AM UTC

    Thanks! I think I was surprised and a little shocked at first. Two days to process it and I’m just annoyed at this person for creating drama where there was none. But I’ve already put this sort of plan into action. Keep everything very structured, provide guidance and support, but that’s it. I have plenty to focus on myself. Basically, “not my monkeys, not my circus” unless it directly is affecting the job.

59. AnonymousDecember 11,2023 at 1:37AM UTC

    I love your response. SHE IS INDEED CREATING DRAMA...be mindful to not get sucked into her vortex...you got this!!!

60. AnonymousDecember 9,2023 at 7:04PM UTC

    Stop making this be about you, it's completely about her. Clearly her therapist is telling her to do certain things. Keep the distance and remove the "chat" from your relationship with her, keep it just business. If she is getting the job done that is enough. If she isn't then create a pip for the things she is not doing right, like the outbursts in meetings. Move on from this and if you cannot then you can decide she no longer fits your needs on the team but would have to find reasons why. She needs to repair herself and its apparent that she needs to do this alone.

61. AnonymousDecember 9,2023 at 7:22PM UTC

    My advice would be to keep

    it as impersonal as possible she has therapist she doesn’t need to tell you her issues and you don’t need to hear them , make sure you stay professional and keep it that way when she wants to tell you her issues tell that makes you uncomfortable and you need it to stay professional , give her what she asked for professional only . It’s a shame but some people are better off this way keep the way you manage everyone else the same professional and keep going to the happy hours just don’t look for her to show up and if she does no more personal chatting she has told you who she is , personally I don’t think you did anything wrong she has issues and will need to work them out alone . If she is underperforming then you deal with that according to company policy .

62. Cortney SpencerDecember 9,2023 at 8:00PM UTC

    She's trying to be healthy. I would not overthink it. Ask what she means and within professional setting, do what she asks and keep things only work related. I commend this woman for asking for what she needs. So many people out there son't seek therapy or try and improve themselves. We all have things we can improve upon. Each year to my direct reports I ask them how I can be a better manager.

63. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 4:44AM UTC

    when she told me she had started therapy I told her she was very strong in seeking help, and that I had found therapy beneficial in the past. I left it at that and did NOT share anything past that.

    thank you for the advice. :)

64. AnonymousDecember 9,2023 at 8:48PM UTC

    I’m not sure how she can ask you to set a boundary.
    It sounds like you’re trying to be an empathetic boss so I wouldn’t blame yourself. For now I would just run everything by the book. If this is an in office job, then she should come in the office and not ask for exceptions to work remotely. If she needs to deal with personal matters, then she can take PTO to do it. You will give her her tasks and you expect her to deliver on time and to the requirements.

65. AnonymousDecember 9,2023 at 10:45PM UTC

    Whole-heartedly agree with everyone here who has said, "it's not about you". I genuinely believe that when she was discussing this with her therapist, her therapist gave her advice to be careful with blurring the lines between personal and professional lives. Especially if she is in a vulnerable emotional and mental state. I don't think it's necessary to swing the total opposite way and be cold "transactional" as you put it. I would pretend like you don't know anything about the personal things she's shared as well as the "boundary setting" comment. Proceed with the manager/direct report relationship and keep it professional and friendly. You can be an empathetic leader without knowing everything about her personal struggles. Continue to mentor her and help develop her professionally. After all, that's truly your job.

66. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 4:45AM UTC

    I’m going to need a little time figuring out the approach. But thank you for the advice.

67. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 3:51AM UTC

    How I’ve contributed to the situation? I have so little information about what brought on this situation that I’m honestly confused about the entire issue. This isn’t Reddit, don’t worry about my therapy status.

68. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 4:13AM UTC

    I think I’m going to have to reevaluate myself what I feel comfortable with. I’m human too and I’m still a little surprised and frankly uncomfortable with the situation. But maybe in a couple of months after the dust settles this would be something good to try. Thanks!

69. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 4:18AM UTC

    I never asked for her to get super deep with me. Go back and read all the times I mentioned she overshared with me, definitely not all around. I didn’t want to know all this stuff. But on the other hand, it is not unheard of for any of us to have some personal comments in meetings. Such as what we did over the weekend, how our time off was, etc. and this is so overly presumptuous of you. How have I even threatened her career? Why do so many women want to destroy others on this forum?

70. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 4:20AM UTC

    I have accepted them and will be respecting them. But I’m also a human being with my own feelings and whatnot. I’m simply asking for advice and processing it.

71. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 4:23AM UTC

    and no one is but you.

72. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 4:38AM UTC

    Would love to know how I’ve been abusing my power and where I’m playing victim? No one is the victim here. I’m simply confused about the situation.

73. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 4:42AM UTC

    The amount of women that love tearing others down on this forum is so sad.

74. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 1:32PM UTC

    You’re making this about you and it isn’t. Keep it professional, keep your conversations work related and move on. The ball is in her court to change the dynamic if that is appropriate for her.

75. Christina caughlinDecember 10,2023 at 1:38PM UTC

    sounds like her therapist is trying to help her developer new behaviors to help her build strength, confidence and build healthy relationships. This isn’t about you doing something wrong. It’s about her asking for your help because she doesn’t k ow how to not overshare. You can build a deeper trusted relationship with her by helping her to recognize when she is getting in to her personal again and help guide her. Let her know you’re helping her set those boundaries. She doesn’t need to share the details but she can tell you what she needs in order to be supported. You can also guide her to other resources in the organization if it seems like she needs to talk it out. Either EAP and also dig in to the other mental health resources through the benefits. There are many more these days . Especially those that can help all of us when we’re a bit stuck. Benefits like Ginger, Talkspace, etc that are now being offered through many medical plans.

76. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 1:58PM UTC

    Exactly she is probably codependent like me and I have found myself being the over sharer even when a tiny amount of relatable personal info is shared with me. Nothing personal she is going through a very rough time. Probably very emotionally abusive partner. It does sound like she's very lucky to have you. I have also struggled being aggressive and defensive at work due to major anxiety and issues at home

77. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 7:58PM UTC

    That was the gist I got from what she told me. Again, did not want to dive into details, more just asking how I could support her.

78. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 7:56PM UTC

    Thanks so much. I have referred her to EAP and stated I myself have benefited from therapy (no further details). And yes, I definitely don’t need or want to know the details.

79. Madeline M.December 10,2023 at 2:17PM UTC

    Just have 1:1 at the office and limit the chats about her personal life. When work is going good, at least that’s a bright spot she can look forward to when things are not going well in other areas of her life.

80. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 2:26PM UTC

    Sounds like she is just offloading her anger on you. It is nothing to do with anything you did wrong. Sadly, often the distressed person picks on the person who has been kind to them.

81. Sir John McPoopington XVII JrDecember 10,2023 at 2:30PM UTC

    I legit feel for you, I’ve had very similar happen to me. You don’t necessarily want to be the “good guy” but my guess is you try and manage people in a way you yourself want to be managed and that’s completely understandable.

    The problem is (in my experience at least) is that some people have no clear distinction between work and human life and not only do personal

    issues flood into the workplace, I think for these people work and personal relationships and rules of engagement become almost interchangeable. It’s 100% not your fault and can’t really be planned for, I think, hard as it is, you just need to be up front and tell her that the working relationship between you would benefit the both of you from a little reset and boundary setting of its’ own and hope she doesn’t take it as an attack.

82. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 7:54PM UTC

    Exactly! There is no winner or loser in this. I respect her for speaking up for herself. I think that’s great and will support her from a distance. Thanks for your kind words.

83. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 2:46PM UTC

    I wouldn't take this personally. She's asking you to set boundaries with her to help her. Her experiences have made it so that she cannot maintain the level of relationship you're wanting to have and that's okay, but this is definitely isn't about you. We can maintain healthy work relationships without talking about our personal lives with each other and it will take more effort on your part as the leader to make this happen. But remember, this is not about you or anything you did.

84. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 7:52PM UTC

    I never asked to be friends with her nor expected it. But our work does require us to work closely together in investigations, providing workforce training, etc. so we developed a rapport.

85. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 3:19PM UTC

    Hi! I would agree with your husband - your direct report is definitely going through something personal and it's tough on her. However, it seems like it's tough on you too - but really, there's only so much you can do.

    As someone who's also going through a tough time now, I let my boss know generally of the situation but don't expect him to be impacted really. Because I've gone through similar, maybe even tougher, scenarios before, I expect management to be understanding of what I can and can't control. I appreciated that understanding and compassion tremendously and that management had recognized I'm a good employee going through a tough time. Offer her any resources the company has like an EAP (employee assistance program) and encourage her to take PTO when she needs it. For you, try not to take her issues personally, I've been where she is and she may just feel isolated and tormented on the inside and is trying to cope - the emotions are strong and can be confusing though. Empathy goes a long way but so does self care for yourself. You sound you care very much but don't get too emotionally involved because she still needs you to be a good supervisor at work.

86. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 3:57PM UTC

    Hi, would like to explore your 3rd point more. It seems like she’s being open with you (her style) and your style is less personal. Maybe this is something you could reflect upon yourself as well while helping coach her on different boundaries for different people.

    She’s trying to help you understand her situation and your reaction re: her maturity seems off-putting rather than supportive.

87. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 7:51PM UTC

    I would never express that to her. However, there is a definite difference in where I was at her age. And that’s ok, different life experiences. It’s merely my opinion and observation. Again, that is not something I would express to her because it’s frankly none of my business. Just like I sometimes don’t like someone at work but keep my opinion to myself.

88. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 4:30PM UTC

    I am an empathetic leader and manager. However, it is best not to dive into the direct reports personal life. If they express that they are going through some tough time, listen and discern if there’s something you can help at work so they can continue to perform their jobs.

    Many mangers wants to be like by their staff. While this is understandable, do know that you are not responsible for their personal happiness. You both are hired to do a job.

    Focus on mentoring them professionally by providing constructive feedback on their work. Offering training and guidance. If they are sensitive individuals, limit the personal hang out gatherings. You can take them out for coffees and work lunches as 1:1. Focus only on topics at work as less they have personal issues that would affect their work such as physical/mental health issues, family issues etc.

89. Lori Hall FergusonDecember 10,2023 at 7:53PM UTC

    I would take her at her word since it sounds like she's approached you in good faith and likely with help from her therapist to broach this subject with you. I'd interpret her wanting firm boundaries to mean she doesn't need to attend any activities that aren't strictly work-related—no more meetings outside the office. Replace the happy hour Fridays with a Monday morning check-in over coffee in your office. Give her firm deadlines, honest feedback, and ability to seek clarification on any projects. It may not be your ideal, but some employees need clear lines between work and home life especially if she's in a mental health slump. Be supportive, ask if she needs any accommodations you could provide, like all things need to be written, etc. and try to work with her. If you've invested time and want to make this work for both of you, you may have to give up your dreams of a closer buddy relationship. I'd look at it like she feels comfortable enough to ask so that is a big win!

90. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 8:12PM UTC

    Oh I will probably never even try to do anything like an off-site again. A closer buddy relationship is not my “dream.” I really just want a productive work environment with little drama. My leadership training came from the military, which is surprisingly more empathetic than what a lot of people would think. But I do feel like I tried to meet this employee where she was, and will continue doing so.

91. CocoDecember 10,2023 at 7:55PM UTC

    It's evident from your post that you've invested a great deal of effort in mentoring your direct report, and you should be commended for your dedication. While it's natural to feel a mix of emotions in this situation, I encourage you to view it from a different angle. The fact that your employee felt comfortable enough to seek professional therapy and communicate her needs to you is a testament to the safe and supportive environment you've created.

    Rather than feeling saddened, consider this an opportunity to be proud of the role you've played in her journey. It's a significant achievement to foster such trust and openness in a professional relationship. You've been more than just a supervisor; you've been a catalyst for her personal growth.

    In moving forward, respecting her request for more defined professional boundaries is the best course of action. It doesn't diminish the value of your mentorship; it simply marks a new phase in your professional relationship. Continue to be the empathetic and understanding leader you've proven to be, and remember that the best leaders are those who adapt to their team members' evolving needs.

    Your situation illustrates the complex dynamics of workplace relationships and the importance of adaptability and respect for individual boundaries. Hats off to you for handling this with such grace and empathy!

92. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 8:15PM UTC

    Thanks so much. I was really beating myself up and analyzing where I went wrong. Yes, I completely respect her request and plan to honor it, while also keeping her accountable as an employee. I got this, it’s just going to be a little awkward at first. But growth happens when you’re uncomfortable.

93. CocoDecember 10,2023 at 8:40PM UTC

    Absolutely, and you're not alone in feeling that way. Society often conditions us to equate discomfort with wrongdoing, but in many cases, like yours, it's actually a sign of progress. You've navigated this situation with empathy and professionalism, leading to a positive outcome for both you and your direct report.

    Embrace this discomfort as a catalyst for personal and professional growth (for you and her !). It's a clear indicator that you're stepping out of your comfort zone, which is where true development occurs. You're doing an excellent job, and this experience is only going to strengthen your leadership skills. Keep up the great work !

94. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 9:28PM UTC

    Truly, thank you so much for the positivity and reframing. I am going to embrace this as growth and move forward in a positive, professional direction. Hopefully I will have a good update in a few months. ;)

95. CocoDecember 11,2023 at 4:21AM UTC

    There you go ! A Win-Win !

96. Kim GreenDecember 10,2023 at 9:53PM UTC

    Right. Being a safe space has its ups and downs. She may not yet have the words to express how the "toll" happens, or pin down specific conversations where this occurred. It's a weight that's being addressed but isn't untangled enough yet.

97. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 10:13PM UTC

    Yeah I do worry for her in this aspect because of taking other’s difficulties and internalizing them. I am very careful to not tell her anything at work that doesn’t directly involve her. For example, I had some conflict with my boss over the last few months due to his lack of feedback. I made sure not to even hint about that to her; we’ve resolved it since and moved forward but I always kept any discussion about him very respectful and positive. Literally I think the only difficulty I’ve shared with her is annoyance at traffic and most recently my Ulta order being super late. lol. But understand she is going through something that does not involve me and is somehow affecting her, even though it doesn’t mean I did anything wrong.

98. Sarah ChambersDecember 11,2023 at 6:49AM UTC

    !!! This ^^^

99. Christi LopezDecember 11,2023 at 2:02PM UTC

    Excellent response!

100. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 9:26PM UTC

     No, but you’re saying that it makes you uncomfortable with your leadership trying to establish any kind of rapport with you. Even though all my leadership training has said the opposite, within boundaries. Everyone is different. But you seem to think everyone feels the same way as you. Maybe some do, some don’t. And that’s ok, but that’s where as a leader you need to get to know your people enough to know how to approach them. I’m not getting defensive, and I understand the different perspectives but you can’t paint everyone with the same brush.

101. Wanda ShawDecember 10,2023 at 10:02PM UTC

     Your husband is right..there is something that’s going on with her. And it has nothing whatsoever to do with you. She sounds emotionally fragile and unstable. And it seems to all be a direct result of the dysfunction in her personal life. If what she needs from you as her manager is a more structured working relationship by all means accommodate her. While it’s great of you to want relax the office etiquette, maybe it’s something that she can’t handle right now.

102. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 10:07PM UTC

     Thank you and that’s my plan going forward. I’ll root for her from afar but that’s about as involved as I’ll get.

103. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 11:34PM UTC

     You’re making this sound like I’m spending sleepless nights over this. I’m definitely not. I am a person though and have feelings. Mostly just confused by the situation because it literally came out as of nowhere. But on a scale of 1-10 of difficulty I’d put this at a 4.

104. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 11:39PM UTC

     Who ever said her emotional well being is my responsibility? That is definitely not what any of this is about. I’m not her parent. Wtf is up with people on this site like just making up stuff that was never stated?!

105. AnonymousDecember 10,2023 at 11:45PM UTC

     I know you said you don’t expect to be buddy buddy, but inadvertently you’ve become too involved in knowing her business. That’s on her but not you however you need to set boundaries on what you allow yourself to know. Sure you care about her success and well being but how much she shares about her own person business is not something you should be getting emotionally involved or take personally. It has nothing to do with you on a personal level. You’re hurt because you made it such. It’s not your job nor business to be her therapist as she is paying someone to do that. Sure you want to understand, but do not internalize it. You can care by stepping back, not getting involved emotionally or directly unless it starts affecting her output at work . Ask how she’s doing and if she elaborates, fine. If not, don’t pry. Let her come to you as she should already know you’ll support her if needed. Step back and give her the space she needs.

106. Liz MilneDecember 10,2023 at 11:56PM UTC

     It sounds to me like she's asking for your help: 'Help me, I know I overshare with you, which means I get inappropriately invested emotionally: please stop me when I go outside the bounds of business propriety.'

     Having said that, it's a big ask to force you to cut her off when she's oversharing personal info. I can see that causing issues too...

     But also, she's probably in a bit of turmoil after the break up of her relationship and trying to learn how to set boundaries with EVERYONE, not just you.

     I would keep doing the same things you have been, but not meet up with her on a social basis unless everyone else from the office is there too.

     Maybe tell her you're happy to help her, but she needs to give you a bit more specific detail on how you can help her establish those boundaries?

107. AnonymousDecember 11,2023 at 12:45AM UTC

     Don’t take on another’s stress. Listen to your spouse. It’s hard but will protect you.

108. AnonymousDecember 11,2023 at 4:26AM UTC

     I’d schedule a follow up with her and ask for some examples so you can understand and support her and not unintentionally hurt her.
     I’d do it in person say over a lunch.

     I’m really sorry for you. I had a similar situation where my reportee began missing deadlines, seniors were complaining, so I tried to give her piecemeal assignments, and she went to department head and said I was micromanaging her without giving me any feedback. Then she stopped talking to me completely and kept badmouthing me to the company. I was relieved when she voluntarily left.

     So I guess it could get worse so I’d handle it sooner and not let it fester. And write notes to yourself on the steps you’re taking and get HR’s advice so you’re protected from being sued for hostile work environment or other claims.

109. AnonymousDecember 11,2023 at 7:59PM UTC

     Thanks for this advice. I already had a 1:1 scheduled with her for tomorrow so I'm using it to reset expectations and boundaries.

110. Sarah ChambersDecember 11,2023 at 6:45AM UTC

     First, all you've described, from an outsider, you're a great boss and mentor.
     I've managed through similar. Not everyone is going to pull in you're emotional intelligence. I share a lot more personal, but not everything as I do with friends and husband.
     I agree with scheduling a follow up and talk through examples or use it to get to the root of it which could be completely unrelated to you. It's worth staying true to yourself and be grateful that you are the type of leader that cares about humans (not just with words). Maybe they're overwhelmed and while work still matters, it could help uncover things to offload for a bit to afford space and ensure business keeps going. I've taken on tactical tasks of folks on my team that were managing through challenges at times.

     In my case, there was a lot more onion to peel back. Unfortunately not everyone is able to grab the olive branch at the moment, but know you've made an impact. Having had many leaders in my career it really matters that you're human. My last 2 were horrible and toxic, last one also a micro manager. It put me in a bad place, but many amazing ones before them, and valuable positive feedback from people I've led ultimately got me back up.
     So again, you're making an impact that may only be fully realized down the road, but it will come to surface at some point in they're lives.
     For now, they may need it to be more structured, more mapped out with deadlines, and still open.
     I too have taken 1x1s offsite. Don't stop that. It drops the walls and energizes creativity.

111. AnonymousDecember 11,2023 at 6:27PM UTC

     Thank you. So many people have been so cruel about this. They've treated me as if I'm overbearing or toxic. She was new to the company and new to the area, plus it was something she had suggested early on, and I thought it was a great idea. I've had time to process it, and my initial shock has dissipated. Again, thanks for being kind and not crucifying me like some of these others.

112. AnonymousDecember 11,2023 at 9:40PM UTC

     Also, just to add I too have had some horrific supervisors in my career. I've only had one or two that were fantastic, with the majority just meh. I've always tried to be the leader I wish I had had to guide me through my career. At the last organization I worked at, I deployed during 2020 (I'm a Reservist). Even before I left my boss was actively retaliating against me for the deployment, as well as engaging with HR when her buddy/direct report was actively bullying my direct report. She wouldn't address it, so I went to HR. Halfway through my deployment I started getting nasty e-mails from HR, stating they had heard from a former employee that had been terminated for well over a year that I was not planning to return to work. I immediately went to JAG, who encouraged me to file a USERRA complaint. Unfortunately it didn't go anywhere (discrimination being hard to prove). She had red flags from the get go; actively wanting to hang out, yelling and cursing at people. I didn't trust her from day 1 she became my supervisor (didn't hire me, I got inherited).

     Just saying, I try not to be a nightmare. Don't have to be besties with my reports, but I like to at least be collegial.

113. Bradford McCormickDecember 11,2023 at 7:11AM UTC

     If it wa me (advice is cheap, of course), I whould get myself in oreer and set bounderies. I would apolizize for not having don wthis adequately in past. Clearly specify what material outputs this person must produce. Off er to help in terms of the work environment but mke it clear that this erson's personal life is none of your biusiness. If th eperson cannot meet minimum functional requirements, the usiness of the business is tha business. Do the best you can as a representative of the company, not as an individual person.

     Perhaps irrelevant: I recall workin gin a situation where a certain accommodation was made for a difficult employee but then a line wa drawn. the person had severe Tourettes syndrome and we accepted outbursts of them screaming obscenities in the office. But when they demanded to be promoted to manager the ansswer was "No" that it wa not felt they had the qualities to be a manager (they were highly technically skilled although even there they had issues which were put up with because they ge tthe work done). They quit and wanted to come back, and that too was offerrred , but no in a managerial position so that wa sthe end of it.

     I do not like hte idea of "happy hours". I did once have amanager wher ethe boundaries were broken but it wa a very special situation: he wa an ETHICAL GIANT who led from the front by example and was also among other things legally blind so he needed a coworker to be his seeing eyes so he could pilot his boat, etc. There are usually exceptions to every rule but your case does not sound like one of them, does it to you?

114. AnonymousDecember 11,2023 at 6:34PM UTC

     ...so your example is that your company wouldn't promote a person with a disability? I am so confused by this post.

115. TestE CullDecember 11,2023 at 12:16PM UTC

     Some people just dont enjoy socializing at work ?

116. Sarah ChambersDecember 11,2023 at 12:31PM UTC

     Respectfully, this is a bit more than socializing. That said, not enjoying socializing is perfectly fine. The OP can always openly ask if the outside 1x1s aren't preferred. A good boss is really hard to find. I've managed teams and can to this day remember preferences, working styles, and motivators for most I've managed. It's not about socializing. It's about teamwork and the OP noted this person shared a lot more that they did on a social level. Managers have to be able to lead a team of people that are different. End goal may be the same, but how each employee drives and delivers results can be slightly different (operationally same, but approach and SME can and in my experience has been different.

117. AnonymousDecember 11,2023 at 6:33PM UTC

     I really appreciate your insight. Many of these people commenting seem to have very limited leadership experience or work in very rigid environments.

118. TestE CullDecember 11,2023 at 10:54PM UTC

     Speaking as the sort of extreme introvert that found the lockdowns during Covid to be pleasant beyond words, the best thing you, as my direct manager, could possibly do to motivate me and keep me from jobhopping again? Pay me 45k/yr or better, stay out of my time off, and if we are to interact on a non job related level I will initiate. ? All I ask. Good paycheck, 40 hour weeks, leave me be, and I'm happy as I can be working. Course every person is different, but that's my perspective on things.

     I am, after all, there for one simple reason: Food isnt free.

119. AnonymousDecember 11,2023 at 11:04PM UTC

     Totally respect that, and honestly, I've had leaders I've felt the same about. I did not want to spend more time with them than what was required. I would never have done this if she felt hesitant or uncomfortable; it seemed like we both enjoyed it. I hate "mandatory fun" as much as the next person.

120. TestE CullJanuary 7,2024 at 3:05PM UTC

     Even if the 'mandatory fun' is something I'm huge into...IE RC airplanes...I'd still hard no out of the event.

121. Laura BuehlerDecember 11,2023 at 12:54PM UTC

     Is it possible this person has a drinking problem and is trying to tell you the happy hours need to stop? Or, do they have money problems and is trying to tell you they can't afford to go out every Friday? ( Assuming each person pays for themselves.) Maybe she's feels like she's not getting all of her work done and doesn't want to leave early on Fridays so she can finish her work? Maybe she just doesn't want to be friends with you and wants to keep work issues at the office.

122. AnonymousDecember 11,2023 at 6:22PM UTC

     The off-site was originally her idea. I don't need her to be my friend, nor is it anything I have pursued.

123. AnonymousDecember 11,2023 at 12:58PM UTC

     I find that EQ is very low for many people today, especially younger people.
     Overprotective parenting is often to blame. Whatever it is, it is very disruptive and even dangerous. Sadly, she will ruin it for anyone else who may report to you or that you work with for fear of something like this happening again.

     I would talk to HR to beat her to the punch. She sounds extremely unstable and immature, the rampant victimhood mentality that is sweeping the nation. Protect yourself!

124. Deborah GoldsteinDecember 11,2023 at 1:23PM UTC

     I agree with much of what has already been suggested — keep the lines of communication open with her, contact HR for advice, and document everything. After all, your relationship is a professional one and she needs guidance on what that means.

125. Michele ColemanDecember 11,2023 at 2:48PM UTC

     I had to learn the hard way that I am not someone’s therapist. I’m empathetic but I try not to get too attached. We’re all balancing work and life.

126. Terrie McWhorterDecember 11,2023 at 3:19PM UTC

     Woah Hoss....you are taking this way too personal. (In my opinion) Honestly, step back and take a look at this for a moment...that took a TON of courage for that young girl to speak up. She was probably practicing on you, what she needed to say to her mother. She felt comfortable with you. Appreciate that. This is about HER not YOU. Give her space and let this go. She is your one direct report. This is not the end of the world but the beginning of a new way to look at things. BEST of LUCK

127. Ellyn Specker CharapJanuary 17,2024 at 6:23PM UTC

     "Practicing on [a supervisor] what she needed to say to her mother" is not terribly professional, and having to handle that kind of behavior - itself a breach of well-understood social norms and supervisor's role - is not something supervisors should be expected to handle because an employee has psychological/personal growth to go through.

     Additionally, any interaction is about both people in the interaction, not just the person in the "employee" role.

128. Natalie Sena MurrayDecember 11,2023 at 3:25PM UTC

     Consider this a blessing. I've supervised individuals with similar quirks only for them to have outbursts that have been detrimental for all. Be transactional with this person and the utmost professional as they will be a problem in the future.

129. RachelDecember 11,2023 at 6:19PM UTC

     100%. You did what you could to be professional and empathetic at the same time. Keep her at arm's length (professionally and personally)!

130. Suellen VanceDecember 11,2023 at 5:09PM UTC

     It can be jarring when something like this happens - especially if it felt out of the blue. But it's very possible that the time you spent with her previously helped build a quiet foundation that allowed her to recognize things in her life that needed work. To move forward and actually develop healthy work habits (like not sharing every detail in her world at work), she may be in fact following your tacit lead. Since you say you haven't shared person information, she may be:

     a) feeling vulnerable about how much she has shared without quid pro quo

     b) learning she doesn't like that feeling and coming to understand what is appropriate in the workplace

     c) working to become a healthier and more respected colleague by exercising some emotional consistency which may be hard to do if the nature of your relationship was her emotional life constantly on display

     d) this is a good thing for her and as her boss/mentor, you can help her by giving her the space to figure out

     e) try to remember, this is about her growth and her actions are about her - in fact, saying this to you may have been one of the hardest things she's ever had to do and she may not have done it well.

     f) Be kind to yourself, you probably helped her get to this place where she could take this step. You may never know this for sure, but give yourself the benefit of the doubt.

131. AnonymousDecember 11,2023 at 6:03PM UTC

     She's being honest about her boundaries when in fact she's saying that she is a people pleaser, which means it was not easy at all to be honest. U should be proud that alongwith her therapy, you being a good leader has allowed her to confide in you. I think shes being quite vulnerable and very trusting of you when she said that she wants you to create boundaries. This speaks to me that u are a good leader and have earned trust. However, u might not be preapared to deal with her honesty currently because she has been quiet about her issues earlier. Dont take it personally. keep being yourself.

132. AnonymousDecember 11,2023 at 6:20PM UTC

     I do take issue with you telling me I'm overreacting and saying I was "dragging them off company property." Super rude. Check yourself. If you can't be constructive move along.

133. LORI-ANN BURLINGAMEDecember 11,2023 at 9:03PM UTC

     Does your company have an Employee Assistance Program? If you do, she needs to make an appointment. I'm a pscyhology major, this is an observation and not a evaluation, but she is "transferring" her issues to you. As a manger, you need to have boundaries. You are not responsible for the decisions she makes. She dumping on you.

134. AnonymousDecember 11,2023 at 9:27PM UTC

     We do and I've made sure she's had the information. Thank you. :)

135. AnonymousDecember 11,2023 at 9:31PM UTC

     I never said everyone should be comfortable talking about their personal lives at work. I said I have an employee who tends to overshare and is now pulling back.

136. AnonymousDecember 11,2023 at 11:12PM UTC

     This is not direct feedback; I'm a direct communicator and this is you embellishing the details of the situation. Nobody was dragging them anywhere. I don't operate in manipulation and coercion as you seem to suggest.

137. AnonymousDecember 12,2023 at 6:03PM UTC

     UPDATE: I had my scheduled 1:1 with my employee today. I started off by telling her about her merit increase, so I started off on a positive note. I then apologized for not setting professional boundaries well and would do so going forward. I also stated that if I felt cold and distant, it was because I was not comfortable and wanted to be careful about what I said in our interactions.

     I then provided initial feedback to start off our new FY with some areas of opportunities going forward; I let her know she's doing great and these are things that would just help her improve. She was really receptive to all of this.

     Finally, we went over her proposed goals. I gave her some constructive advice and how to craft SMART goals. She's going to review and talk about them again at our next 1:1.

     All in all, I think it was really good. We reset expectations and can move forward in a positive, professional way.

     Thank you to everyone who gave me constructive, positive advice; it was greatly appreciated and really helped me manage in the best possible way.

     I'm not going to waste much time on those who did the exact opposite...just to say I think it's sad when women just want to tear each other down.

138. LORI-ANN BURLINGAMEDecember 12,2023 at 6:46PM UTC

     I'm glad that your 1:1 went well and that she feels more confident. Unfortunately, a lot of managers do not take the time to think and plan how best to address an employee who is experiencing difficulties.

     I've been in the business world for over 30-years and have countless war stories. It is painful when other women viewed my kindness as weakness and take advantage of it. Their self-centeredness and lack of respect maded it difficult to work with them.

139. AnonymousDecember 12,2023 at 6:58PM UTC

     I'm an overthinker thanks to ADHD + childhood trauma. :) I feel relieved we addressed the elephant in the room and can move forward.

140. Sarah ChambersDecember 12,2023 at 7:37PM UTC

     People responding with toxic comments perhaps are projecting, are themselves toxic or lacking emotional intelligence. I'm glad it worked out and again, appreciate you taking the time to care.

141. CocoDecember 12,2023 at 10:59PM UTC

     Congratulations on the successful outcome of your 1:1 meeting! It's heartening to hear how effectively you've navigated this situation, balancing professionalism and empathy. Your approach in resetting boundaries and offering constructive feedback is commendable and sets a positive example for workplace communication.

     On the note of the varied responses you've received in this community, I firmly believe that as members, we all have a role in upholding the community's standards of respect and constructive engagement. It's crucial for all of us to contribute to a supportive and respectful environment. Diverse opinions are valuable, but they should always be expressed in a manner that aligns with our community.

     Once again, well done on navigating your professional relationship with such care and thoughtfulness! Your approach serves as a great example for others in similar situations.

142. AnonymousDecember 12,2023 at 11:49PM UTC

     Big virtual hugs to you, Sarah Chambers, Lori-Anne and all the other posters with support. It’s hard navigating these sorts of issues and you all were so encouraging. :)

143. AnonymousDecember 12,2023 at 9:38PM UTC

     I have had a similar experience as I also like to build friendships at the workplace and think it is important for my wellbeing at work. I have found that with my direct report I have to keep it on a purely work based conversation and not deviate to any personal discussions due to how they see the workplace functioning in their lives and their personal needs. While being respectful of their privacy on personal matters I was not sure if they were keeping information I had shared private as well. It saddens me because those relationships are what build community, trust and respect as well as longevity with the company.

144. AnonymousDecember 13,2023 at 2:45PM UTC

     I hope she figures out what works for her because I think she's going to have a difficult go of it.

145. AnonymousDecember 14,2023 at 2:40PM UTC

     Who mandated anything? Don't you have a bridge to sit under?

146. AnonymousDecember 15,2023 at 6:22PM UTC

     That might be your interpretation but my interpretation and the interpretation of others was that it was overly negative and full of blame. I've fully said I'm open to her side and improving. Maybe you should examine your words and delivery.

147. AnonymousDecember 15,2023 at 6:24PM UTC

     That is so not even close to what you said. It's great when people can hide behind the anonymity of the internet to tear others down.

148. Ellyn Specker CharapJanuary 17,2024 at 6:17PM UTC

     First, you sound like a wonderful supervisor, and I desperately wish that any of my supervisors I had back when I was in my 20's had been as engaging as you are! Luckily, in my 30's, I met two who have helped me immensely and now we are very close.

     Second, is she GenZ? I have noticed that GenZ employees do tend to want very clear-cut, boundaries-oriented working relationships. This is odd to me also - I always craved and so try to provide friendly mentorship to my employees. That model seems to have been relegated to the past, though. (This pains me no end - my own mentors and I have wonderful, deep relationships and I wish everyone could have this).

     I guess, if pressed, and based on some experience with GenZ, I'd advise resetting your framework from mentor/mentee or team coworkers to "teacher-student."

     Let her come up with a set of workable boundaries (which will help her learn how to set them). Then hold her to them, along with her work schedule and her work product.

     I'd also explain that boundaries in a work place have to be "co-constructed," meaning that you need to have some input on what your relationship looks like too. Just make sure that her boundaries suit your schedule and basic supervisory needs, and tell her that you have learned that boundaries can grow broader over time and with trust, and that you are open to her widening or narrowing her boundaries as needed.

     However, her boundaries do need to meet basic working requirements, such as allowing for impromptu work conversations. She needs to understand that whatever her psychological or developmental stage, work is often a moving target and you still may have to be able to communicate with her on, say, Thursday at 4:15 pm about a hard curve on a project, even if her desired boundary is "no communication with me except from 10 am to 2 pm, so I can focus from 3 to 6 pm."

     I'm so sorry. I would be hurt too. But I really do not see this as any reflection on you, your good nature, or your abilities as a supervisor. And you're such a decent person to be there for her even with this request! I don't know about you, but I'm in my mid-50's, and there was this interesting word back in my day for people who came up with individual, psychotherapy-driven personal boundaries for their supervisors to follow. The word? Why, that word was, "fired." As in, "Pack your things, you're fired."

149. Oxana SlessarevaMay 31,2024 at 1:36AM UTC

     Boundaries are important at work. I would not recommend going for drinks with direct reports. It sets up messy expectations.

     it is always good to focus on work performance as the driving force of work relationships. Is she a strong performer? It is not clear from the story.

     it seems you personally have a need to be friends with direct report and this drives the level of closeness and the current confusion. If this need can be dropped, you will see situation pretty clear. Focusing on work performance can be delightful and uplifting for all parties involved for as long as work is important to both manager and to employee.

     I would not encourage any therapy talks by communicating once firmly that although I do wish her well, I am not trained in therapy and would prefer not to discuss it but instead focus on work.