Last week I was informed that my current position will be changed from office administrator to HR Director.

37 Comments

1. AnonymousAugust 10,2023 at 12:43PM UTC

   I forgot to mention that they’ve made the offer to someone and they are waiting for her response.

2. AnonymousAugust 10,2023 at 1:01PM UTC

   I’m so sorry this happened to you - it makes you feel undervalued, I’m sure. But in this job market, I would keep the job and if you feel like you cannot trust the management, I’d suggest you start discreetly looking for another job. If you’re looking for another Administrator type role, you should see what the requirements are in the marketplace. If you don’t have a degree, you may need a certificate of some sort to make sure you’re competitive for those roles. Sending you my best wishes!

3. Tasha CampbellAugust 10,2023 at 1:09PM UTC

   U been there for 30 years your over qualified forget a degree! People mad wild

4. AnonymousAugust 10,2023 at 1:24PM UTC

   If you have been doing the work and they will not let you have the position because your pedigree lacks the sufficient letters, there is something else going on. My guess is they are looking for a way to gently encourage you to leave, without doing anything that could bring a lawsuit down upon them. Often companies will do a little bit of “restructuring” to remove a role in order to get rid of someone. As long as your salary isn’t taking a hit, I’d stay until you find something else. And do start looking.

5. AnonymousAugust 11,2023 at 2:03PM UTC

   I disagree. The original poster does not have an undergrad degree, let alone a master's degree. Times changes. the business has grown and changed too and it was time to create some descriptives to the HR director role- makes sense. it hurts, but we could also say that the original poster "should" have been thinking about completing a Bachelor's degree- online/night classes, etc- over the years. The work world is highly competitive and a degree is not a "pedigree"- it's a demonstration o work/progress/completion and skill growth... I do think the original poster has been treated well in this transition...no disrespect, no money loss--companies cannot be expected to protect long term employees when new individuals are being brought on who have the additional education/training. Things have changed in the thirty years this woman has been there...

6. Andrea DoverAugust 13,2023 at 4:45AM UTC

   That actually isn't true at this point. It used to be. These days many businesses value experience over degrees:

   https://hbr.org/2023/02/how-important-is-a-college-degree-compared-to-experience

7. Jennifer FranklinAugust 10,2023 at 1:40PM UTC

   I am sorry this happened to you, I recently had a similar experience. Unfortunately my hours were cut which means I make 1000 less per month. Fortunately for me I have always worked a "second job" as a pet sitter so I am able to nearly make up the loss financially doing this. Like you I felt very demoralized I actually had to take a day of PTO as a mental health day. Since then (3 weeks) the management has not found anyone to fill in the gap and keeps giving me back duties making my current 32 hours a bit hectic. I'm looking quietly to move on but have decided to expand my pet sitting rather than invest in another dead-end job. I would suggest you do the same, as much as we would like to live with the "it's just business" philosophy, after 30 years it's not, this is your life and you deserve to work where you are valued and appreciated.

8. AnonymousAugust 10,2023 at 1:53PM UTC

   As sole breadwinner for your family, I would definitely take the new role offered (the job marketis very difficult right now), learn what you could (including having the company pay other certificates and training, business conferences. Etc) and then start figuring out what you want to do to improve and grow your career.

   Unfortunately when you stay at a company for so long you often lose your value in the eyes of leadership. They see no growth and devalue your contribution (not true but perception is what it is). So you are treated like a game piece that can be moved wherever they feel like it.

   Use this as a springboard to figure out what you want to do with your career. You need to have a plan because at some point they may show you the door and you want options.

9. Kimberley Ferretti HammettAugust 10,2023 at 1:58PM UTC

   For some clarification, why does this feel like a demotion to you? I can definitely understand having put that much time in, it feeling like a slap in the face. On that front though, can I offer some outside perspective? (Of course, knowing there may be things about the situation I don't know)

   From what you've mentioned, it sounds like most likely you've been doing some HR or HR adjacent work in your Office Administrator role and the company (I'm assuming small, maybe recently growing) realized they now needed a full HR focused role that comes with more knowledge of running an HR function. Since they can't get you that knowledge overnight, they are offering you a paralegal role which, at least in terms of title, sounds like a promotion from the title of Office Administrator. Objectively, this is a promotion.

   How they went about this mess is totally off. (Probably could have been more tactful if they had an HR consultant lol). They should have informed you of their needs the first time they began thinking of it and either made a plan to develop you toward it or made the plan to promote you to paralegal. Even if you were already doing the same or similar work, your title was not right-sized to it (this is common in small companies that grow though... my mom was an office manager for an attorney's office for over 30 years and she did work like payroll etc because they weren't big enough to have a full HR. Employees tend to grow fast with it and wear many hats). Honestly, with this in mind, you might have some leverage to counter and ask for a raise with this title change. I would do some research on paralegal salary and aim for the high-mid to low-high range considering your 30 years there. If that is lower than what you are currently making, maybe you could ask for an increase in perks or benefits like time off.

   On a personal standpoint, if I were in that situation I might express my preference for communication in the future. This is just me and totally personal, but I don't like to fester on frustration and not give the other person a chance to address it and potentially mend the wound they inflicted. I would try to keep the conversation objective and factual, but address it in a way to say "hey, I understand the business function of this, but I'd prefer if we could plan these moves together. After 30 years I feel like a partner in this business so it caught me off guard to have this sudden move. Had I known the needs were shifting we could have prepared together and it would give me a chance to transition better for all of us".

   Those are my 2 or 3 cents. If the perspective isn't helpful that's totally ok but I hope it is! Good luck, I'm sorry they dropped the ball here but hope whatever happens it works out for the best for you!

10. Darlene MirtoAugust 12,2023 at 6:07PM UTC

    Personally, I don’t believe someone with an MBA is going to want to do administrative work. Just my two cents.

11. AnonymousAugust 10,2023 at 2:44PM UTC

    Keep your job and prepare to retire.
    Have HR provide you a written/email of expected pension allocation and expected date to receive pension. I did that and now that I am retired, I do contract work for companies I want to work with only. You worked and put in your time don't leave your pension on the table.

12. AnonymousAugust 14,2023 at 7:16PM UTC

    I wouldn't take any action suggesting you plan to retire..unless you are sure that is what you are going to be doing.

13. AnonymousAugust 10,2023 at 3:00PM UTC

    Being offered a job with a new title isn't so bad. You could take the job while searching for a new position in your prior role or your new one. Having this extra experience helps.

14. AnonymousAugust 10,2023 at 3:08PM UTC

    If the money is the same and the work is equal or less -- then take it -- don't let it get to you. As you said, it's just a business decision

15. AnonymousAugust 10,2023 at 7:48PM UTC

    Thanks for all the great feedback. I appreciate it! I must say that I’m currently studying for my certification as a legal professional. So that’s in the works. Meanwhile this is a good opportunity to brush up on my paralegal skills. Thanks again I feel much better.

16. AnonymousAugust 11,2023 at 12:53PM UTC

    I wouldn’t worry about being blindsided or demoralized and you shouldn’t feel that way, as long as the direct deposit is coming through your bank every 2 weeks, who cares?

    you’ve been there 30yrs so just enjoy the ride and laugh all the way to the bank.

17. AnonymousAugust 11,2023 at 2:00PM UTC

    I would just worry because you're going to be in charge of other employees and if something goes wrong it's going to lead right back to you and they could say shes not qualified or she's new at this position. I would tell your company that I wanted them to pay for courses on human resources so that you could familiarize yourself with it really

18. Laura TalonAugust 11,2023 at 1:56PM UTC

    Ok, just to get this straight, you’re going from an admin role to a director role and keeping the same salary? And they’re making your current position redundant?

19. Julie EAugust 11,2023 at 5:28PM UTC

    They weren’t offered the director role. You missed a lot of information.

20. AnonymousAugust 11,2023 at 1:56PM UTC

    oh goodness , DO NOT LEAVE. they've attempted to treat you AS NICELY as possible...they are keeping your salary and giving you another position. This is the best they can do without giving one employee- you- "special treatment". Yes, it's a business decision but you've been treated well. It does hurt, but this is a change that aligns with industry/HR standards, so PLEASE don't take this personally. the company obviously had no other choice but chose to keep you in every way possible.

21. KPAugust 11,2023 at 1:58PM UTC

    Oh my god so they're restructuring the company you've been with for 30 years and didn't tell you about it?? Are you qualified to even be a human resource person? That's crazy I'm sorry that happened

22. Mary PoolAugust 11,2023 at 1:59PM UTC

    I agree with everyone else, stay, take the new position, and enjoy the new challenges. I would caution, however, not to be sucked into doing your old job. It is no longer your responsibility, and you could easily be agreeable to "helping" during the transition or helping train a new person (perhaps forever). The new department is entitled to your full attention. It is your future; this old position is in your rearview mirror. This is a new opportunity for you, don't lose it by being sucked back into your old job. Practice your replies, be professional but firm, "I'm sorry, that is no longer my position. See XYZ, and they will help you now." For the new person, "It is your position now. It would be best if you made it yours. It doesn't matter how I did it. Proceed as you see fit." Repeat as needed.

23. AnonymousAugust 11,2023 at 3:54PM UTC

    There's a big difference between the job responsibilities for Office Administrator and HR Director. Were you doing HR work before? If so then it sounds like they were taking advantage of you, so if it were me I'd take the senior paralegal role and enjoy the fact I was keeping my same salary, and if they came to me asking me to help out with HR work in addition I'd be like "'Not unless you give me the title/pay."

24. Bridget HarringtonAugust 11,2023 at 7:28PM UTC

    I have a different viewpoint than others reading this and what you do depends on the organization and how comfortable you are with confrontation.

    After 30 years, they "restructure" the position that you have been filling and tell you at the last minute? It sounds to me like they "restructured" to move you aside to bring in someone outside the company with those credentials. BUT, they apparently were happy to have you do that job for 18 years without the credentials. HR hasn't changed that much for this to make sense (if it were something like IT or engineering, there might be a point) in any other way than what I said. So I would absolutely take this decision as "personal" because it is personal to you and a comparison. I'd be asking:

    1) Why did they not take your "transferrable skills and experience" into consideration? I don't have an MBA, but my experience and other education can stand in as the equivalent. Yours likely can, too. And if it doesn't, I'd ask why the company did not consider sending you for more education. It is cheaper to invest in an existing employee than it is a new person that doesn't know the company.

    2) Being the sole breadwinner is never a justification for being bypassed or taking less than you are worth. You might consider this position a consolation...but consider this: If you are getting to keep your salary while doing a lower tier job, you were likely underpaid for the job you did do. It might be worth shopping yourself around to other companies; you might find a better position. I personally could not stay there, because what they did, business decision or not, shows profound disrespect for you and your contribution up to that point.

    3) I'd discuss this with an employment lawyer. Even if you live in an At Will state, there are procedures that have to be followed before they let you go (which is what they essentially would have done if you didn't take the lower position). If you have been there 30 years, I'm going to guess you are 50s or 60s. There may be ageism involved here, too...particularly since they were happy to have you do the higher level job until "a better option" appeared. If that option turned out to be, say, the age that your child would be, you have your answer. Employers can be really sneaky this way....don't give them an easy road.

    4) Under no circumstances should you "train your replacement." If you are asked to do this, it backs up everything I said. Also refer again to #3.

25. AnonymousAugust 12,2023 at 12:58AM UTC

    Given that they are allowing her to keep her same salary, I fail to see what an attorney would be able to assist with. Also, a lot changes and grows in 18 years. It is quite likely that they actually do now require an MBA to handle their HR needs.

26. D TAugust 12,2023 at 12:59PM UTC

    Correct, the company is doing the labor law legalities by offering you an existing position, if you decline, they would not pay unemployment- as evidence by the severance offered. It sounds like leadership is needing to meet some HR requirements (which unfortunately sometimes dictate degrees attached to roles for liability purposes or contract requirements). In this case, it sounds like they value you to give you 2 options that meet your credentials, but ultimately leaving it up to you. Sounds like the company is at a crossroad and so are you. With contract liabilities increasing and standards being tied to education, we see this alot in my field of social work. Unfortunately, having degrees doesn't mean you can do the job better than someone like yourself who has hands on experience; but it depends on contract language and leadership values/approaches. This decision is what is best for you:

    Are you burnt out and could use a small break - to rest and/or find another job while taking some time out- then take the severance. If you like your company and leadership and the direction it is going, you may want to stay- may be worth it. If you don't take the severance. If you'd rather stay b/c you need to or feel having a gap in employment feels wrong and you need the benefits, Stay in the new role, and look for your next job while employed. The best time to look for a job is when you have one. Given that you have not interviewed in years potentially, you will need to have security while you take those steps on the back end. It's stressful, but it can work. I did this exact thing.

    At this point its the strategy you want to take - not the emotion to the demotion. All in all - YOU take care of yourself how you need to and they have offered you a few options to do that- you just need to decide which is more aligned to who you are and what you need today.

27. AnonymousAugust 12,2023 at 12:40AM UTC

    If you need to stay then stay. But be aware as things start to shift. This latest change tells you how the leadership views you.

28. Darlene MirtoAugust 12,2023 at 1:05PM UTC

    I don’t believe someone needs an MBA to be an HR Director. We’re you doing the HR duties?

29. AnonymousAugust 12,2023 at 6:57PM UTC

    Yes I did it all. From payroll to open enrollment as well as facilities, year end parties aaaand office “therapist” for staff. I’m happy to know that I’m respected and well liked as my bosses and staff have told me.

30. Heather Saville GuptaAugust 12,2023 at 2:19PM UTC

    How about if you offer to do an online MBA while starting the new role? Tho a jump from admin to HR director seems a bit of a jump. Will the HRD have to do all the admin work too?

31. Milissa JacobsAugust 12,2023 at 3:24PM UTC

    So they are requiring an MBA for the job that you have been doing for almost 2 decades without one? You've been there for quite a while. Do you want to stay? If you do, you can accept the different position and move on. You indicated that you're inclined to stay, so my advice is to not take this personally and finish your career there quietly. An MBA to manage HR seems like a big reach, however, with the job market the way that it is now, not a surprising one. Do you want to get your MBA? Would they be willing to work with you as you did? Or are they trying to move you from the position? Good luck. If it were me, I would either go back to school if that is an option, or take the position offered in the other area, and finish out my time there quietly. It stinks when a company treats you as only another cog in a wheel after so many years.

32. AnonymousAugust 12,2023 at 3:30PM UTC

    I really feel for you, I have/am going through the same thing, but without your amazing tenure. Are they bringing in another office administrator?Personally having been a Admin Director, office administrator, and EA in the just few years due to covid. Personally, I would say you'd have greatest career opportunities being a HR director.I would do it for a year, get the company to pay for some courses and then look for other opportunities.

33. Linda QuarshieAugust 12,2023 at 6:39PM UTC

    Something to think about, but if you’ve been in this role for 30yrs, I’m wondering how many more years is left for you in the workforce? What have you accumulated here that you will lose such as company stock, pension etc that is not easily replaceable.

    it seems the company likes you and what you bring, are you prepared for a new environment where you are not sure what to expect? You stated you are the breadwinner, do you think you can make more (ie 20%+) somewhere else? If you can make more, it is worth exploring but I don’t think the company is making this decision out of malice (I know you didn’t say that) but companies just like individuals, need to constantly keep showing that they are hiring the best and the brightest and unfortunately that can show up in having candidates with the MBAs or from certain schools and things of that sort.

    good luck in your decision making.

34. AnonymousAugust 12,2023 at 6:51PM UTC

    Thanks for your feedback. I also don’t think they made that decision out of malice. I’ve worked with both of my bosses for over 20 yrs and they said it was nothing I did wrong. Considering I believe I have at least another 15 yrs left I’ll take the paralegal position which is where I started when I was hired.

35. AnonymousAugust 12,2023 at 7:56PM UTC

    Assuming that there is no changes to the position you were originally working, then I'd file an age discrimination complaint with the EEOC. As there is no valid reason to require someone to have an MBA to work in an HR position.

    I happen to be a small business owner, and I'm the sole employee currently in my business, however, I'm also well aware of what is and isn't legal to do as an employer, and I don't have anything higher than associate's degree that is heavily concentrated in business courses. I run the entire company myself, and I'm more than capable in doing so, as I've done the research and I sought out help to learn the things that I needed to in areas of my business that I wasn't as initially strong in my knowledge

36. AnonymousAugust 13,2023 at 2:17PM UTC

    You're getting a lot of good advice here. I think you might want to stay for a while and see how the new MBA works out. It might turn out that the company's wishes are unrealistic. The new hire might not want to do all the administrative tasks and might quit or make life miserable for the rest of the C-suite. The company might end up realizing that requiring an MBA was not a good idea and they'll want you back.

37. AnonymousAugust 14,2023 at 1:06PM UTC

    This sounds to me like they are trying to look out for you as a long time employee that they like and trust. They could easily give you the boot and they are not doing that. I would trust them when they say it isn't personal, until they show you through their actions that it was. A lot of the comments are reading a lot into this with negative assumptions. And while those could be true, maybe you are someone lucky enough where the company is actually looking out for you. So my advice is believe their words until their actions show you differently